Piano tuning question

Greetings,
There are many different octave widths used in a piano. A beatless
octave is impossible, so the decision involves the tuners judgement. The
middle of the piano is usually able to be tuned with nearly a 2:1 octave, but
as you progress upwards, keeping this width will cause the double and then
the triple octaves to sound flat.
Our teaching at the North Bennet School had us tuning the octave, then
checking it against the fifth and fourth that the new note formed, and then
checking to see that the new note continued the even progression of thirds,
tenths, seventeenths. It is not usually possible to satisfy all these checks
with one pitch, so compromises are made. Sometimes the fifths would need to
be slightly out of line to keep the thirds even enough, sometimes the octave
will need to be slightly wider to keep the fifths clear.
I am usually tuning 6:3 octaves by the time I reach the top of the piano.
Making a smooth transition from the 2:1 in the middle to the 6:3 at the top
is where experience comes in. Done properly, all the octaves sound alike,
though a careful ear will hear the beating in the single octaves above the
fifth octave of the piano.
In the bass, the amount of stretch depends on the usage. Recording studios
require less stretch down there to keep the bass guitars happy, but on the
concert stage, I prefer to do the same thing as I did in the treble, just in
reverse!. You can't hear a fifth's tempering in the bottom two octaves, and
the thirds are just a mish-mash of critical band noise. However, those 6ths
and 17ths can be heard to beat easily and that is how one may line the
octaves up as the pitch goes low.
Melodically, the excessive stretch works, but the price is paid in
harmony.
Regards,
Ed Foote RPT
Nashville, Tn.

--- a440a@aol.com a �crit�: > Greetings,
> There are many different octave widths used in
> a piano. A beatless
> octave is impossible, so the decision involves the
> tuners judgement. The
> middle of the piano is usually able to be tuned with
> nearly a 2:1 octave, but
> as you progress upwards, keeping this width will
> cause the double and then
> the triple octaves to sound flat.
> Our teaching at the North Bennet School had us
> tuning the octave, then
> checking it against the fifth and fourth that the
> new note formed, and then
> checking to see that the new note continued the even
> progression of thirds,
> tenths, seventeenths. It is not usually possible to
> satisfy all these checks
> with one pitch, so compromises are made. Sometimes
> the fifths would need to
> be slightly out of line to keep the thirds even
> enough, sometimes the octave
> will need to be slightly wider to keep the fifths
> clear.
> I am usually tuning 6:3 octaves by the time I
> reach the top of the piano.
> Making a smooth transition from the 2:1 in the
> middle to the 6:3 at the top
> is where experience comes in. Done properly, all
> the octaves sound alike,
> though a careful ear will hear the beating in the
> single octaves above the
> fifth octave of the piano.
> In the bass, the amount of stretch depends on the
> usage. Recording studios
> require less stretch down there to keep the bass
> guitars happy, but on the
> concert stage, I prefer to do the same thing as I
> did in the treble, just in
> reverse!. You can't hear a fifth's tempering in the
> bottom two octaves, and
> the thirds are just a mish-mash of critical band
> noise. However, those 6ths
> and 17ths can be heard to beat easily and that is
> how one may line the
> octaves up as the pitch goes low.
> Melodically, the excessive stretch works, but
> the price is paid in
> harmony.
> Regards,
> Ed Foote RPT
> Nashville, Tn.
>

Hi there

Excellent explanation !
Just one question...do you use any electronic tuner ?
And if yes, what's the reference scale ?

Best regards

Dimitrov

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--- In tuning@y..., a440a@a... wrote:

/tuning/topicId_27903.html#27903

> Greetings,
> There are many different octave widths used in a piano. A
beatless
> octave is impossible, so the decision involves the tuners
judgement. The
> middle of the piano is usually able to be tuned with nearly a 2:1
octave, but
> as you progress upwards, keeping this width will cause the double
and then
> the triple octaves to sound flat.
> Our teaching at the North Bennet School had us tuning the
octave, then
> checking it against the fifth and fourth that the new note formed,
and then
> checking to see that the new note continued the even progression of
thirds,
> tenths, seventeenths. It is not usually possible to satisfy all
these checks
> with one pitch, so compromises are made. Sometimes the fifths
would need to
> be slightly out of line to keep the thirds even enough, sometimes
the octave
> will need to be slightly wider to keep the fifths clear.
> I am usually tuning 6:3 octaves by the time I reach the top of
the piano.
> Making a smooth transition from the 2:1 in the middle to the 6:3
at the top
> is where experience comes in. Done properly, all the octaves sound
alike,
> though a careful ear will hear the beating in the single octaves
above the
> fifth octave of the piano.
> In the bass, the amount of stretch depends on the usage.
Recording studios
> require less stretch down there to keep the bass guitars happy,
but on the
> concert stage, I prefer to do the same thing as I did in the
treble, just in
> reverse!. You can't hear a fifth's tempering in the bottom two
octaves, and
> the thirds are just a mish-mash of critical band noise. However,
those 6ths
> and 17ths can be heard to beat easily and that is how one may line
the
> octaves up as the pitch goes low.
> Melodically, the excessive stretch works, but the price is paid
in
> harmony.
> Regards,
> Ed Foote RPT
> Nashville, Tn.

Thanks, Ed, for the commentary. We learned to use "test chords," too
so, it seems, part of the reasons for those was to distribute some of
these ideosyncracies...

________ _______ _____
Joseph Pehrson