octave stretch(from Temp. equal/new)

Wim writes:

>accepts that every new octave will be a 1/7th
> Pythagorean comma wide! So every 3/2 is perfect but only this interval
>and not the 3/1 or the 4/3.

>As a piano-tuning this makes sense, since the phenomena of inharmonicity
>demands larger octaves if they want to be perceived as just to the human
>ear. (Paul, Ed, Carl, am I right about this?)

Greetings,
You are right, to a degree. The inharmonicity in a piano does require
that the octave be pure at only one common partial,( pianos will usually have
either a 2:1, 4:2 or a 6:3 alignment, depending on where that octave is).
Putting 3.4 cents into the middle octaves of a piano would create some very
busy thirds. I normally keep the octave near pure(2:1) in the middle,
allowing the stretch to increase as I go up. The studio pianos do better
with a tighter bass, since it causes less trouble with the Korg-tuned bass
guitars....... (on the concert stage, I let the piano stretch more in the
bass, giving as much purity to the triple octaves above as possible).
If carefully done, octaves can be stretched a lot more as you go up from
the "cash register"(about the fifth octave), since the effects of temperament
lessen as you move away from the middle three octaves of the piano.
(Debussy's "Clare de Lune" opens with some thirds that are high enough to
sound the same in virtually all tunings, while Plomp and Levelt demonstrated
that there is no consonant third in the bottom two octaves).
Steinway stage tuners in New York have a tendancy to begin tuning pure
fifths from near C5 on up. They speak of the additional "brilliance" and
presence that this gives the sound, but they cannot even fathom why someone
would not use 12 ET! Go figure.
Regards,
Ed Foote
Nashville, Tn.

Incidentally, When I asked to either retune or bring in a piano for the
upcoming MicroFest concerts, I was refused by the 2 churches in New York.
Old habits die hard.

Johnny Reinhard

--- In tuning@y..., Afmmjr@a... wrote:

/tuning/topicId_27536.html#27538

> Incidentally, When I asked to either retune or bring in a piano for
the upcoming MicroFest concerts, I was refused by the 2 churches in
New York. Old habits die hard.
>
> Johnny Reinhard

That's *terrible* news, Johnny. Did you solve it??

__________ __________ ___
Joseph Pehrson

If my strings of my guitare are olds-I dont move my
frets... but I change the strings ;)
The piano can be accorded using ear guided metod, but
here we discuss other things...

Dimitrov

--- a440a@aol.com a �crit�: > Wim writes:
>
> >accepts that every new octave will be a 1/7th
> > Pythagorean comma wide! So every 3/2 is perfect
> but only this interval
> >and not the 3/1 or the 4/3.
>
> >As a piano-tuning this makes sense, since the
> phenomena of inharmonicity
> >demands larger octaves if they want to be perceived
> as just to the human
> >ear. (Paul, Ed, Carl, am I right about this?)
>
> Greetings,
> You are right, to a degree. The inharmonicity
> in a piano does require
> that the octave be pure at only one common partial,(
> pianos will usually have
> either a 2:1, 4:2 or a 6:3 alignment, depending on
> where that octave is).
> Putting 3.4 cents into the middle octaves of a piano
> would create some very
> busy thirds. I normally keep the octave near
> pure(2:1) in the middle,
> allowing the stretch to increase as I go up. The
> studio pianos do better
> with a tighter bass, since it causes less trouble
> with the Korg-tuned bass
> guitars....... (on the concert stage, I let the
> piano stretch more in the
> bass, giving as much purity to the triple octaves
> above as possible).
> If carefully done, octaves can be stretched a
> lot more as you go up from
> the "cash register"(about the fifth octave), since
> the effects of temperament
> lessen as you move away from the middle three
> octaves of the piano.
> (Debussy's "Clare de Lune" opens with some thirds
> that are high enough to
> sound the same in virtually all tunings, while Plomp
> and Levelt demonstrated
> that there is no consonant third in the bottom two
> octaves).
> Steinway stage tuners in New York have a
> tendancy to begin tuning pure
> fifths from near C5 on up. They speak of the
> additional "brilliance" and
> presence that this gives the sound, but they cannot
> even fathom why someone
> would not use 12 ET! Go figure.
> Regards,
> Ed Foote
> Nashville, Tn.
>

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