Re: hey margo!

Hi,

you said

> Final cadence (_clos_) Internal cadence (_ouvert_)
>
> E4 F4 G4 A4
> B3 C4 D4 E4
> G3 F3 Bb3 A3
>
> Here _ouvert_ is French for an "open" or inconclusive ending, and
> _clos_ for a "close" or conclusive ending. Note the fluidity of the
> degree B/Bb (or German H/B), fitting the "closest approach" rule that
> thirds expanding to fifths or sixths to octaves should be major.
>

I just got a whole mess of CDs from the list on the medievel
site. Great stuff and exactly what I was looking for.
Regarding the first cadence, One thing I hear done sometimes
is a sort of apogatura-kind-of-thing (to get scientific) where
it goes

E4 D4 F4
B3 C4
G3 F3

Now I hear it in tonal terms somthing like VII- II I which is
unusual but right on target for a harmonic cadence in lydian
(not that the authors were thinking in those terms). You
could do the same thing with the second cadence.

Is the use of the D just an embellishment? Was it common, as
it seems to go against closest approach (and I know they don't
do the E4 D4 E4 F4 sequence that you would hear if it was a
V I cadence a few centurys later).

Bob Valentine

--- In tuning@y..., Robert C Valentine <BVAL@I...> wrote:

/tuning/topicId_23599.html#23599

> >
>
> I just got a whole mess of CDs from the list on the medievel
> site. Great stuff and exactly what I was looking for.

It's worth reiterating that purchasing Medieval and Renaissance CDs
from this site is the EASIEST and MOST SPECIFIC way imaginable...

And you get to read some of Margo Schulter's articles as a bonus!

The site again is:

www.medieval.org

____________ ____ _____ ____
Joseph Pehrson

Hello, there, Robert, and thank you for a very pertinent question about
what is often known as the Landini cadence.

For now, I'll offer this link (hopefully giving the right site for my
article this time), with more comment by this evening, I hope.

http://www.medieval.org/emfaq/harmony/landini.html

For the moment, I might just add that something like

D4 F4
B3 C4
G3 F3

in itself follows the later Gothic rules of closest approach, since the
_unstable_ interval (here the major third) expands to the "nearest" stable
consonance (the fifth) with one voice moving by a whole-tone and the other
by a diatonic semitone. The fifth G3-D4 is a stable interval, so that the
14th-century rule doesn't apply, although of course the progression
becomes yet more dramatic and efficient if we bring the major sixth E4
into play before F4. Together, the Pythagorean third (81:64) and sixth
(27:16) add some excitement to a very effective cadence.

Most appreciatively,

Margo Schulter
mschulter@value.net