Stravinsky. Moron creative process?

Like they say, "I don't think so..."

From today's New York Times interview with composer/conductor
Esa-Pekka Solonen:

[Solonen:}

"In all Stravinsky's music, the harmonic identity is incredibly
strong," he said, "even in terms of doubling, of what notes are
doubled in different octaves and how they're orchestrated. If you
change anything at all, it's like a red flag to the ear. That aspect
of music I enjoy..."

Don't we sometimes speak of "identities" on the Tuning List?? It's
the same basic concept, I believe.

The idea that INVERSIONS of chords are totally distinct from one
another... a kind of hearing that manifested itself more and more in
the 20th century... (leading toward microtonality?? maybe...
"Klangfarbenmelodie" certainly...)

So, even if Stravinsky found "solace" as is stated in his
autobiography, that he worked at the piano and had only 12 notes he
had to worry about (!), in the sense of orchestration and chordal
"identity" it was, of course, much more than this.

His particular orchestration as part of this process, was about as
"abstract" and individual as anything could get....

And he even lived in LA!

________ ______ _____ ____
Joseph Pehrson

Joe!
I have been saying this all along, inversions of chords are different animals, of course
helmholtz pointed this out .
Also we do not know what Igor's piano was tuned to.

Stravinsky had great respect and perceived the true beauty of the folk musics of other
countries as well as the lower classes of his own country , much to the horror of Rimsky and
audiences alike. Bartok even more so. Partch took the next step necessary.

Verdi and Pucinni have to be given credit for drawing upon the lower classes for their subject
matter. Joyce is given credit for this in literature, but being the singer he was, you can see he
took his cue from these two. We have to thank the likes of John Adams for regressing back to
Aristocratic personalities as being the "worthy" to talk about.

Solonen, who is the best conductor LA has had, referred to Bernard Hermann as the folk music
of LA. Why not go to the thief's source and say Mussorgsky. Like it or not ( i being not) , The
Germs are the folk music in LA. The Philharmonic is as close to Fritzcaraldo in their attitude of
bringing Opera to the Amazon that one could imagine. That I think I'll put away my razor and reach
for my spray can.

jpehrson@rcn.com wrote:

> The idea that INVERSIONS of chords are totally distinct from one
> another... a kind of hearing that manifested itself more and more in
> the 20th century... (leading toward microtonality?? maybe...
> "Klangfarbenmelodie" certainly...)
>
> So, even if Stravinsky found "solace" as is stated in his
> autobiography, that he worked at the piano and had only 12 notes he
> had to worry about (!), in the sense of orchestration and chordal
> "identity" it was, of course, much more than this.
>
> His particular orchestration as part of this process, was about as
> "abstract" and individual as anything could get....

I am not sure what you mean by abstract in this context?

>
>
> And he even lived in LA!

-- Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria island
http://www.anaphoria.com

The Wandering Medicine Show
Wed. 8-9 KXLU 88.9 fm

--- In tuning@y..., Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@a...> wrote:

/tuning/topicId_20117.html#20119

> Joe!
> I have been saying this all along, inversions of chords are
different animals, of course helmholtz pointed this out .
> Also we do not know what Igor's piano was tuned to.
>
> Stravinsky had great respect and perceived the true beauty of
the folk musics of other countries as well as the lower classes of
his own country , much to the horror of Rimsky and audiences alike.
Bartok even more so. Partch took the next step
necessary.
>

Thanks for the "cool" and interesting commentary, Kraig!

_________ _____ ___
Joseph Pehrson

--- In tuning@y..., Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@a...> wrote:

/tuning/topicId_20117.html#20119

[Stravinsky}
> >
> > His particular orchestration as part of this process, was about as
> > "abstract" and individual as anything could get....
>

> I am not sure what you mean by abstract in this context?
>
> >

Sorry Kraig... I missed the second part of your message.

I just meant that he had to IMAGINE the orchestration, obviously,
since he didn't have all the instruments right there when he was
composing, even though he used the piano to first play the notes he
wanted...

And it was very SPECIFIC... a change of instrument would "ruin" the
balance, of course...

[I wasn't meaning the MUSIC was "abstract." Actually Stravinsky for
the most part is almost the OPPOSITE of abstract even in his 12-tone
works as you know. He wants people to "grab" his sound right away,
and makes it very personal ...]

___________ _____ _____
Joseph Pehrson

Kraig Grady wrote:

> Joe!
> I have been saying this all along, inversions of chords are
> different animals, of course helmholtz pointed this out .
> Also we do not know what Igor's piano was tuned to.

But we do know that he often composed with a piano whose strings were
dampened. Not the regular timbre it seems.

A!
Fascinating!

Alison Monteith wrote:

> But we do know that he often composed with a piano whose strings were
> dampened. Not the regular timbre it seems.

-- Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria island
http://www.anaphoria.com

The Wandering Medicine Show
Wed. 8-9 KXLU 88.9 fm

--- In tuning@y..., Alison Monteith <alison.monteith3@w...> wrote:
>
That's interesting, Kraig! I had never heard that! Greetings from
Moscow!

Joe

>
> Kraig Grady wrote:
>
> > Joe!
> > I have been saying this all along, inversions of chords are
> > different animals, of course helmholtz pointed this out .
> > Also we do not know what Igor's piano was tuned to.
>
> But we do know that he often composed with a piano whose strings
were
> dampened. Not the regular timbre it seems.