How to make microtonal music?

Hi,

My name is Toni Ahvenainen and I'm new in this list. I joined because I
want to create microtonal music. But I don't know how to make it.
Usually I make electronic music with computer programs such as
Cubase Sx and virtual soft synths. I would like to do some microtonal
stuff with those programs, but I'm not sure how. I've understood from
somewhere else, that I need some programs to feed midi to cubase sx
(since cubase only has 12 notes in octave). So I'm sure someone here
knows good apps that would help me and other helpfully stuff also.
I'm also very interested if someone could advice what kind of scale I
should use. I know there are different kinds of scales, like 24, 19, 43 or
something other notes in one octave. I would like to know if someone
has opinions of which scale could be suitable for idm-geeck (intelligent
dance music, don't ask...) like me. I must admit that I'm not very good
even with normal scales, so I guess 24 would be easier than 43??
If people have any other advices for novice I would love to hear.

Toni.

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine" <tahvenaine@c...>
wrote:

> My name is Toni Ahvenainen and I'm new in this list. I joined because I
> want to create microtonal music. But I don't know how to make it.

One absolutely must-have program is Scala. This can, among a great
many other things, produce midi files with microtonal pitch bends.
Such a midi file is, of course, already microtonal music, and can be
converted to an audio file which sounds better by means of a midi
renderer. I would recommend Timidity for that. Both Scala and Timidity
are freeware!

Another freeware program which is very flexible (it doesn't have the
limitations of midi, and can produce any electronic sound you can
dream up) is Csound, but I'm afraid there's a good deal more to learn
to make it work.

> I'm also very interested if someone could advice what kind of scale I
> should use. I know there are different kinds of scales, like 24, 19,
43 or
> something other notes in one octave. I would like to know if someone
> has opinions of which scale could be suitable for idm-geeck
(intelligent
> dance music, don't ask...) like me. I must admit that I'm not very good
> even with normal scales, so I guess 24 would be easier than 43??

Actually, 43 might be easier than 24 since using 24 as a meantone
system leaves you inside of 12. This, I am afraid, is a huge topic,
and even when you've chosen a scale you need to learn how to make it
work. A popular choice of late has been a scale of 21 tones out of 72
called Blackjack. You could look at the archives on the tuning group,
and ask questions. Joseph Pehrson is a composer, not a tuning wizard,
and he uses Blackjack, so I am sure you could also.

One question we might ask is what sort of microtonal music would you
prefer to make?

Hello,

> My name is Toni Ahvenainen and I'm new in this list. I joined because I
> want to create microtonal music. But I don't know how to make it.

The place to start is with Scala, as others have said. It has the built-in
capability of auditioning different tuning systems. You might want to try
some of the "N-equal-tones per octave" systems which are easy to use and
give spicy results.

You will find the Midicode soft synth to be a great pedagogical tool with
really nice tuning interface for experimentation, and it's an all-in-one
solution with built-in mixer, etc. I recommend Midicode as a good starting
point -- very inexpensive with a good tutorial and tuning discussion paper.
http://www.midicode.com

Also I think the Rhino soft-synth demo can also load Scala tuning files.
(I know the full version for 100 euros can load tunings; I'm not sure if
the capability is in the demo version.)
http://bigtick.pastnotecut.org/index.php?action=PROD&pcode=140

Rick

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine" <tahvenaine@c...>
wrote:
> Hi,
>
> My name is Toni Ahvenainen and I'm new in this list. I joined
because I
> want to create microtonal music. But I don't know how to make it.
>
> Toni.

You have some good advice on software. My views on how it can be
made are overly simplistic and should spark some objections but here
goes. Study music from other countries (PBSU Has a telecourse
call "Exploring the World of Music"). The different regions all have
rules or guidelines. You will want your own set of rules and
guidelines (which you will amend by project). Start with music from
India perhaps. Start with scales you can make using the 12 tet
system you have. Keep C (tonic), G (fifth) and F (natural fouth) or
use F# (augmented fourth) pick any two out of the four notes between
C and F also G and C. Now using only the notes in your scale just
selected, construct a monophonic melody. To make a "Raga" make a
fixed lenght rhythmic pattern with a beginning, middle, and end. As
the rhythm cycle repeats start at the tonic (C) again. Add a drone
for color and you are at least getting a feel for what's possible.

LOL,
Jim

> somewhere else, that I need some programs to feed midi to cubase sx
> (since cubase only has 12 notes in octave). So I'm sure someone here

With piano roll editing that doesn't really matter, as long as you
don't use very many notes per octave, in wish case you get a limited
range. Also, there are great possibilities with 12 note scales of
other than 12-tet pitches, such as Just Intonation sets etc. /Ö

HI Toni,

Seven equal is a rather fun tuning to try out - and few notes and
few intervals and chords to - an interesting microcosm.

It turns everythign on its head in a most delightful fashion. The fifths
are dissonances to be resolved. The thirds are so wide that they are
moderately consonant approximating to an 11/9. Then I find in this tuning
the thirds make diads which have a consonance and richness to them
which let's them function more like triads in normal triadic music.
Instead of progressing round a circle of fifths as in II V I etc
you progress round a circle of thirds II - VI - III - I for instance
(diads rather than triads there). Then you can extend the diads
to make more dissonant chords until you get to 0 2 4 8 10 12 14 (scale degrees)
which is your entire scale laid out as a single chord. That chord is sort
of like a diminished seventh since it lets you modulate anywhere.

You can then make modes of seven equal, maybe 0 2 3 5 6 7 for
a little pentatonic scale.

You can bring your tunes to a cadential close quite nicely just using
the diad cadences such as III - I or VI - III - I etc.

(I'm sure this is only one take on seven equal...)

My program Fractal Tune Smithy has an MFX plug in so can be used with Cubase SX or Sonar.

It's not entirely free like SCALA because I am doing this as a business - but you
can use it as long as you like for free with some restrictions -
you are restricted to ten minutes playing time per session
(with a drop list of some free midi in presets to try that never time out).
Also when you try it for free you either see a dialog or a splash screen
when it starts up (can choose which you prefer).

I've just done a version update to version 2.3 (accumulation of
updates, bug fixes etc).

http://www.tunesmithy.co.uk

Thanks,

Robert

>
> My name is Toni Ahvenainen and I'm new in this list. I joined because I
> want to create microtonal music. But I don't know how to make it.
> Usually I make electronic music with computer programs such as
> Cubase Sx and virtual soft synths. I would like to do some microtonal
> stuff with those programs, but I'm not sure how. I've understood from
> somewhere else, that I need some programs to feed midi to cubase sx
> (since cubase only has 12 notes in octave). So I'm sure someone here
> knows good apps that would help me and other helpfully stuff also.
> I'm also very interested if someone could advice what kind of scale I
> should use. I know there are different kinds of scales, like 24, 19, 43 or
> something other notes in one octave. I would like to know if someone
> has opinions of which scale could be suitable for idm-geeck (intelligent
> dance music, don't ask...) like me. I must admit that I'm not very good
> even with normal scales, so I guess 24 would be easier than 43??
> If people have any other advices for novice I would love to hear.

HI Toni,

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "jnagy2002" <jnagy2002@y...>
wrote:
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine"
<tahvenaine@c...>
> wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > My name is Toni Ahvenainen and I'm new in this list. I joined
> because I
> > want to create microtonal music. But I don't know how to make it.
> >
> > Toni.
>
> Start with scales you can make using the 12 tet
> system you have. Keep C (tonic), G (fifth) and F (natural fouth)
or
> use F# (augmented fourth) pick any two out of the four notes
between
> C and F also G and C. Now using only the notes in your scale just
> selected, construct a monophonic melody.

etc. . . . is this really the best advice for someone looking to
create microtonal music? most likely, this person has already played
around with myriad 12-equal scales and needs no further experience
doing so, thus wishing to take the plunge into microtonality . . . in
the latter case, and assuming you're accustomed to unrestricted
transposition, i think one of the best introductions is to play
around with 19-equal and 22-equal, switching back and forth between
the two as one sees fit, so that one is plunged instantly into the
world of unfamiliar intervals while still keeping most familiar
chords pretty much avaiable, while one learns the distinction between
systems that obey diatonic logic (i.e. 19-equal) vs. those that don't
(i.e. 22-equal).

yes, i agree 7-equal is perhaps the best and easiest introduction to
alternate tuning systems. it always seems to sound very "authentic"
and "right" to my ears somehow, either for blues or for orientalisms.

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Walker"
<robertwalker@n...> wrote:
> HI Toni,
>
> Seven equal is a rather fun tuning to try out - and few notes and
> few intervals and chords to - an interesting microcosm.
>
> It turns everythign on its head in a most delightful fashion. The
fifths
> are dissonances to be resolved. The thirds are so wide that they are
> moderately consonant approximating to an 11/9. Then I find in this
tuning
> the thirds make diads which have a consonance and richness to them
> which let's them function more like triads in normal triadic music.
> Instead of progressing round a circle of fifths as in II V I etc
> you progress round a circle of thirds II - VI - III - I for instance
> (diads rather than triads there). Then you can extend the diads
> to make more dissonant chords until you get to 0 2 4 8 10 12 14
(scale degrees)
> which is your entire scale laid out as a single chord. That chord
is sort
> of like a diminished seventh since it lets you modulate anywhere.
>
> You can then make modes of seven equal, maybe 0 2 3 5 6 7 for
> a little pentatonic scale.
>
> You can bring your tunes to a cadential close quite nicely just
using
> the diad cadences such as III - I or VI - III - I etc.
>
> (I'm sure this is only one take on seven equal...)
>
> My program Fractal Tune Smithy has an MFX plug in so can be used
with Cubase SX or Sonar.
>
> It's not entirely free like SCALA because I am doing this as a
business - but you
> can use it as long as you like for free with some restrictions -
> you are restricted to ten minutes playing time per session
> (with a drop list of some free midi in presets to try that never
time out).
> Also when you try it for free you either see a dialog or a splash
screen
> when it starts up (can choose which you prefer).
>
> I've just done a version update to version 2.3 (accumulation of
> updates, bug fixes etc).
>
> http://www.tunesmithy.co.uk
>
> Thanks,
>
> Robert
>
> >
> > My name is Toni Ahvenainen and I'm new in this list. I joined
because I
> > want to create microtonal music. But I don't know how to make it.
> > Usually I make electronic music with computer programs such as
> > Cubase Sx and virtual soft synths. I would like to do some
microtonal
> > stuff with those programs, but I'm not sure how. I've understood
from
> > somewhere else, that I need some programs to feed midi to cubase
sx
> > (since cubase only has 12 notes in octave). So I'm sure someone
here
> > knows good apps that would help me and other helpfully stuff also.
> > I'm also very interested if someone could advice what kind of
scale I
> > should use. I know there are different kinds of scales, like 24,
19, 43 or
> > something other notes in one octave. I would like to know if
someone
> > has opinions of which scale could be suitable for idm-geeck
(intelligent
> > dance music, don't ask...) like me. I must admit that I'm not
very good
> > even with normal scales, so I guess 24 would be easier than 43??
> > If people have any other advices for novice I would love to hear.
>
> HI Toni,

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "wallyesterpaulrus"

/makemicromusic/topicId_4664.html#4675

<wallyesterpaulrus@y...> wrote:
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "jnagy2002" <jnagy2002@y...>
> wrote:
> > --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine"
> <tahvenaine@c...>
> > wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > My name is Toni Ahvenainen and I'm new in this list. I joined
> > because I
> > > want to create microtonal music. But I don't know how to make
it.
> > >
> > > Toni.
> >
> > Start with scales you can make using the 12 tet
> > system you have. Keep C (tonic), G (fifth) and F (natural fouth)
> or
> > use F# (augmented fourth) pick any two out of the four notes
> between
> > C and F also G and C. Now using only the notes in your scale
just
> > selected, construct a monophonic melody.
>
> etc. . . . is this really the best advice for someone looking to
> create microtonal music? most likely, this person has already
played
> around with myriad 12-equal scales and needs no further experience
> doing so, thus wishing to take the plunge into microtonality . . .
in
> the latter case, and assuming you're accustomed to unrestricted
> transposition, i think one of the best introductions is to play
> around with 19-equal and 22-equal, switching back and forth between
> the two as one sees fit, so that one is plunged instantly into the
> world of unfamiliar intervals while still keeping most familiar
> chords pretty much avaiable, while one learns the distinction
between
> systems that obey diatonic logic (i.e. 19-equal) vs. those that
don't
> (i.e. 22-equal).

***For me, the incredible excitement of microtonality was being able
to retune a MIDI keyboard to any n-tET and other scales found in the
Scala archive. Now that Scala allows MIDI relaying, it's a good
place to start "messing around" with different microtonal
possibilities. Then, a synth can be added, since Scala can retune
most common ones, many available easily as "used" ware...

J. Pehrson