Is it an idea to forward old PMG messages to crazy music?

Hi there,

This is just an idea for discussion:

My Archive Magic program can be used to repost all the messages from
the PMG group if wished.

I don't actually have those messages; didn't get it to download them.

However, my program can extract the individual messages from
the digests, if we can find them all. (I have all except the early ones).

I could also get it to generate a list of the e-mail addresses of all those
who posted, since the complete e-mail addresses are shown in the digests,
and then we could mail to them all and ask if they are happy for their posts to
be re-posted, which would also be a way of letting everyone know about the
new group (as some of the members don't belong to the tuning list).

I haven't quite figured out how to program to send an e-mail with the
original author of the post as the apparent originator of the
e-mail, so the re-posted messages would all have to show up
under my name as author, but would be shown as forwarded messages

Like this:

In messages listings:

Author: Robert Walker
Subject: FW: Re: Wooden frets?! - David J. Finnamore

Body of message:

............................

Forward: message from David J. Finnamore originally posted Sun, 20 May 2001 14:28:57

--- In practicalmicrotonality@y..., "Orphon Soul, Inc." <tuning@o...>
wrote:
> Different temperaments wind up having different envelopes.
> 41 resonates noticeably longer than most others thereabouts.

That might be explained partly by the following graph, if you have a
graphical browser:

http://personal.bna.bellsouth.net/bna/d/f/dfin/DefectsETs.htm
...
............................

If anyone wants their messages left out, we could delete those ones
before forwarding all the rest.

It would take a while to do the uploading as one has to keep to
less than 50 messages every 20 minutes. If you go over that
number, then Yahoo's detection system for auto-responding
goes into effect.

Yahoo's problem here is the "I am on vacation" type message
that some people set as an automatic response to an incoming
e-mail. Suppose also they are on individual e-mail subscription.
Their p.c. gets an e-mail from a Yahoo group, replies with the
"I am on vacation" response, that gets relayed back to them
as a post from the group, their p.c. replies to that saying
"I am on vacation" again, ...

So, would upload at rate of one message every 30 seconds, say,
then 450 messages would take getting on for four hours.

Maybe more - e.g. if my ISP disconnects (as it can) and I have
to reconnect.

I could warn you about it in advance, and we could all switch to no
e-mail mode, (or get Jeff to do it for us) while it happened.

However, that seems an awkward solution.

A better idea, if we want to do this, might be to do it the other way round
- I'd ask Jeff to make another group, say, new_crazy_music
then before anyone joins it, I'd forward all the posts from PMG to it.

When that was all done, I'd let you know, and then Jeff can rename crazy_music
to crazy_music_was, and then rename the new_crazy_music to crazy_music.

Then we all rejoin crazy_music.

Then finally, I can repost all the messages from crazy_music_was to crazy_music,
and there we are, all the posts from PMG in chronological order, followed by
the ones from crazy_music.

Anyway, no idea whether this the thing to do, it's something to discuss, but
it may be of interest to know that it can be done if we do decide on it.

Robert

Hi Kraig!

> Yes i am so happy that all of Brian's messages were saved and that we can invite him here also.
Now isn't that nice and friendly

We can leave out all his messages if that's the consensus, as I imagine it might
be; just not repost them.

N.B. I wonder if you know, I removed the digests from tuning_gossip. Haven't actually
read them, and was told that they weren't really that great things to propogate,
plus consideration that there is no implied permission to be able to repost
messages in this way, since the p.m. archives weren't open to the public, though
membership was.

I'm sorry about what I did; I think now that perhaps it was unwise.

If we did go ahead with this, I think one would need to ask everyone else involved
if they were happy for their posts to be reposted, and maybe just leave out all
his posts - as far as I know they were all off topic anyway for the main focus
of what the list was about.

Another possibility would be to use my program to make an archive out of all the
digests, and circulate the zip to anyone who wants it who used to belong to
the PMG.

I'm told some of the material he posted just possibly might be libelous,
so not too keen to be involved in propogating it, so I'd leave his posts
out of the zip too, just to be on the safe side.

It's one thing to provide a place where someone can speak freely. I feel it is
quite another to be involved in reproducing everything that they have said,
if it is slanderous or libelous. I don't know myself as I'm not interested
in it enough to keep going beyond a few sentences, better things to
read I think.

I've got digests 0 and 5 - 26, all except digests 1 to 4.

Anyway, that is all to do with practicalities.

What to do is up for debate!

Robert

> We can leave out all his messages if that's the consensus, as I imagine
it might
> be; just not repost them.

Well... I hate to start re-writing and censoring history... but in the
interests of keeping everyone calm... yeah, they could be just left out.

If anyone comes around and he wants the posts put up somewhere on line, at
least some of us have them squirreled away and could cough them up in a
pinch.

BTW, I think it was as much irresponsible of someone to blithely kill the
PM group without warning and leave the 50-odd subscribers scratching their
heads as it was for someone else to post such seething rants in the 50-100
kbyte range...

Let's move on and talk about music.

Rick

--- In crazy_music@y..., "Robert Walker" <robertwalker@n...> wrote:

/crazy_music/topicId_24.html#36

>
> I'm told some of the material he posted just possibly might be
libelous,
> so not too keen to be involved in propogating it, so I'd leave his
posts
> out of the zip too, just to be on the safe side.
>
> It's one thing to provide a place where someone can speak freely. I
feel it is
> quite another to be involved in reproducing everything that they
have said,
> if it is slanderous or libelous.

Generally speaking, when people receive virulent criticism it is a
good sign that they are doing something substantial.

Certainly you have read Slonimsky's "Lexicon of Musical Invective..?
I know Kraig Grady has... since he studied with him... Very
entertaining.

In that light, perhaps Brian mclarens' comments could be
considered "compliments...??"

__________ _______ _____
Joseph Pehrson

--- In crazy_music@y..., Rick McGowan <rick@u...> wrote:

/crazy_music/topicId_24.html#52

> > We can leave out all his messages if that's the consensus, as I
imagine
> it might
> > be; just not repost them.
>
> Well... I hate to start re-writing and censoring history... but in
the
> interests of keeping everyone calm... yeah, they could be just left
out.
>
> If anyone comes around and he wants the posts put up somewhere on
line, at
> least some of us have them squirreled away and could cough them up
in a
> pinch.
>
> BTW, I think it was as much irresponsible of someone to blithely
kill the
> PM group without warning and leave the 50-odd subscribers
scratching their
> heads as it was for someone else to post such seething rants in the
50-100
> kbyte range...
>
> Let's move on and talk about music.
>
>
> Rick

The fact of the matter is... and this is my LAST non-music comment...
we should "Live and Let Live," "Live Free or Die" etc., etc., etc.,

The moderator should NEVER have the control to nuke the list, or even
to direct discussion, in my opinion!

Jacky probably thought hosing the flames was taking too much time.

All of that wasn't necessary....

People should just IGNORE the posts they don't like....

Nothing should be censored or moderated, in my opinion...

__________ ________ ____
Joseph Pehrson

Joe,

--- In crazy_music@y..., jpehrson@r... wrote:
> The moderator should NEVER have the control to nuke the list, or
> even to direct discussion, in my opinion!

That is nuts. Mailing lists have always come in all flavors, from
totally free to severely controlled. The originator of the list gets
to make the rules, and if you don't like them then get the hell out.

> Jacky probably thought hosing the flames was taking too much time.

No, I'm sure that Jacky was dismayed by much more than that. And he
certainly isn't one to get his jollies by watching, gratuitously,
over-the-top behaviour from the sidelines. He made a nice place, and
someone fucked it up royal.

> People should just IGNORE the posts they don't like....

Try, just for once, looking at it from other's perspectives, like
Graham with the 56k modem, and the complete and self-centered
bandwidth wasting nature of some of those posts (100k+). You really
owe it to the community that you are a part of to view it from some
of the other angles, and then maybe you would see just how egregious
this whole scenario was.

> Nothing should be censored or moderated, in my opinion...

Start your own list, or agree to the terms of whatever one that you
are on. Seems eminantly (sp?) simple.

Cheers,
Jon

--- In crazy_music@y..., JSZANTO@A... wrote:

/crazy_music/topicId_24.html#73

>
> Try, just for once, looking at it from other's perspectives, like
> Graham with the 56k modem, and the complete and self-centered
> bandwidth wasting nature of some of those posts (100k+). You really
> owe it to the community that you are a part of to view it from some
> of the other angles, and then maybe you would see just how
egregious this whole scenario was.
>

Hi Jon...

Well, I suppose that's what Daniel Wolf's complaints are all about as
well...

> > Nothing should be censored or moderated, in my opinion...
>
> Start your own list, or agree to the terms of whatever one that you
> are on. Seems eminantly (sp?) simple.
>
> Cheers,
> Jon

Yes, it's an "e.." Ok... then I must soon start a

Freedom_and_License_Tuning@yahoogroups.com

Joe

_________ _______ _____
Joseph Pehrson

Hi there,

Jacky's okay. I've heard from him.

Robert