Yahoo Tuning Groups Ultimate Backup tuning A delayed Christmas present for the TL people

Hi everyone.

I'll try to be brief this time ... The melodies of most Czech and Moravian Christmas carols are played in ordinary major or minor scales. But there's one which is not. And this is the one on which I've just finished my brand-new variations. First the original melody is played, then various harmonic or rhythmic changes are made, including melodic ornamentation. So, here it is:
www.sendspace.com/file/0gksil

Petr

Hi Peter,

I'll try to be brief this time ... The melodies of most Czech and Moravian
> Christmas carols are played in ordinary major or minor scales. But there's
> one which is not. And this is the one on which I've just finished my
> brand-new variations. First the original melody is played, then various
> harmonic or rhythmic changes are made, including melodic ornamentation. So,
>
> here it is:
> www.sendspace.com/file/0gksil
>

Great tune!
But hmm did you not change the tuning throughout the piece?
It certainately sounds like the tuning is very different in the first part
(which my ear likes) and the last part (which my ear doesn't like).
Or this purely because of the sounds used?

Many thanks,
Marcel

Hi Marcel.

Thanks for the comments.
The sharp piano sound and the two sounds doing the expressive "solo" use the 13-limit scale which you can find in Manuel's archive as "wilson_helix.scl". All the rest is 5-limit JI. And no, I din't change the tuning during the piece.

Petr

Quite nice, Petr, thank you. I especially like the climax
at the end of the piece. I'm from Pennsylvania, very near one
of the original Moravian settlements in the States (the other
being in North Carolina). In Bethlehem there are libraries,
bakeries and classrooms continuously used by Moravians since
the 1600s. So I grew up with the chorales, but I'm not familiar
with this one.

-Carl

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Petr PaÅÃzek <p.parizek@...> wrote:
>
> Hi everyone.
>
> I'll try to be brief this time ... The melodies of most Czech
> and Moravian Christmas carols are played in ordinary major or
> minor scales. But there's one which is not. And this is the
> one on which I've just finished my brand-new variations. First
> the original melody is played, then various harmonic or rhythmic
> changes are made, including melodic ornamentation. So, here
> it is:
> www.sendspace.com/file/0gksil
>
> Petr

I think Peter talks about "Moravian" in the sense of "Moravia", which
is eastern part of Czech Republic, named after the river Morava.
There were some states many years before Bohemian kingdom was
established. (Name Bohemia is also old, as a name of the region along
the river Vltava and Labe, it came from Celtic nation Boii -
Boiohaemum, from Germanic Boi-Heim, "home of the Boii").

As historically Moravia had cultural and liturgical contacts to the
South-East - Byzantion (from where Christianism was brought by Kyril
and Method), also music was influenced by Balcan (Byzantion liturgy
and Carpathian shepherds culture) and Moravian folklore is very rich
and diverse (also thanks to mountaineous character of the country
where different regions were rather isolated and so the very old
music was preserved). Moravian music uses old modes and unusual
chromatic inflexions, while much younger Czech folklore is based on
major/minor scales (mainly major) and was influenced deeply by German
culture.

Peter for sure didn't talk about Moravian Church (Unitas Fratrum)
which is Protestant sect. Their origin goes to Bohemia and Moravia
(well known "teacher of nations" Komensky - Comenius was one of their
bishops), but otherwise they have nothing common with Moravia, also
not in the music. But it's true lot of protestant sects left Bohemia
and Moravia after 1620 when recatholization started in the Czech
kingdom after the lost battle on Bila Hora near Prague. Maybe some of
them came also to USA, but probably much later, in the 19th century,
and the reason was not the faith, but economy.

I also love chorals and anthems and collect them.

Daniel Forro

On 29 Dec 2009, at 10:03 AM, Carl Lumma wrote:

>
> Quite nice, Petr, thank you. I especially like the climax
> at the end of the piece. I'm from Pennsylvania, very near one
> of the original Moravian settlements in the States (the other
> being in North Carolina). In Bethlehem there are libraries,
> bakeries and classrooms continuously used by Moravians since
> the 1600s. So I grew up with the chorales, but I'm not familiar
> with this one.
>
> -Carl
>
> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Petr PaÅ™Ã zek <p.parizek@...> wrote:
> >
> > Hi everyone.
> >
> > I'll try to be brief this time ... The melodies of most Czech
> > and Moravian Christmas carols are played in ordinary major or
> > minor scales. But there's one which is not. And this is the
> > one on which I've just finished my brand-new variations. First
> > the original melody is played, then various harmonic or rhythmic
> > changes are made, including melodic ornamentation. So, here
> > it is:
> > www.sendspace.com/file/0gksil
> >
> > Petr
>
>
>

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Daniel Forro <dan.for@...> wrote:
>
> I think Peter talks about "Moravian" in the sense of "Moravia",
> which is eastern part of Czech Republic, named after the river
> Morava.

D'oh! Of course.

> Peter for sure didn't talk about Moravian Church (Unitas Fratrum)
> which is Protestant sect. Their origin goes to Bohemia and Moravia
> but otherwise they have nothing common with Moravia, also
> not in the music.

Understood.

> But it's true lot of protestant sects left Bohemia and Moravia
> after 1620 when recatholization started in the Czech kingdom
> after the lost battle on Bila Hora near Prague. Maybe some of
> them came also to USA, but probably much later,

1741 for Bethlehem.

-Carl

There are certainly Hijazi maqam elements after about 6:00.

Oz.

✩ ✩ ✩
www.ozanyarman.com

On Dec 28, 2009, at 10:34 PM, Petr Pařízek wrote:

> Hi everyone.
>
> I'll try to be brief this time ... The melodies of most Czech and
> Moravian
> Christmas carols are played in ordinary major or minor scales. But
> there's
> one which is not. And this is the one on which I've just finished my
> brand-new variations. First the original melody is played, then
> various
> harmonic or rhythmic changes are made, including melodic
> ornamentation. So,
> here it is:
> www.sendspace.com/file/0gksil
>
>
>
> Petr
>
>

Like the lot of Moravian music this one is modal, and what's interesting - because the second step in the scale is missing, it can be analysed as hypomelodic minor, or hypoharmonic minor (with Phrygian second). In the second case there is Hijazi tetrachord, but Turkish intervallic patterns are not common part of Moravian music. So here it is only Peter's variation and the way how he used that scale for solo sound. Original song hasn't such patterns. Final Phrygian harmonic progression (minor VII - major I) can give it slightly Near East character. Hypomelodic minor harmonisation (major VII - Major I0 will have less tension and will sound more Slavonic. But I would also prefer Phrygian character.

Moravian music uses mainly Lydian, Ionian, Mixolydian, Aeolian modes, some hypo- modes, unusual key modulations, jumps, chromatic flexions and unexpected harmonic progressions. Turkish music influence is very rare, only in few songs.

Daniel Forro

On 30 Dec 2009, at 11:33 AM, Ozan Yarman wrote:

>
> There are certainly Hijazi maqam elements after about 6:00.
>
> Oz.
>

This is excellent. With the rock guitar at the end, I immediately had in mind 70s prog rock, in particular Genesis (the harpsichord and recorders also a factor), and I would've extended the thing a few more minutes that way, but I'll take it as is.

I also thought of Liszt, Smetana and Dvořák with a bit of Elfman flavor, something that might be heard in a mystery-type movie. And I'm always a fan of theme-and-variations works.

So what's the tuning? It sounds like 5-limit, with more than a few instances of 7 and 11 later in the piece.

~D.

--- On Mon, 12/28/09, Petr Pařízek <p.parizek@...> wrote:

From: Petr Pařízek <p.parizek@...>
Subject: [tuning] A delayed Christmas present for the TL people
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, December 28, 2009, 2:34 PM

Hi everyone.

I'll try to be brief this time ... The melodies of most Czech and Moravian

Christmas carols are played in ordinary major or minor scales. But there's

one which is not. And this is the one on which I've just finished my

brand-new variations. First the original melody is played, then various

harmonic or rhythmic changes are made, including melodic ornamentation. So,

here it is:

www.sendspace. com/file/ 0gksil

Petr

Ozan wrote:

> There are certainly Hijazi maqam elements after about 6:00.

Maybe one of the contributing factors is the mode to which I was limiting the sounds used in the „solos“. It is the 7-tone scale of 13/12, 5/4, 4/3, 3/2, 13/8, 11/6, 2/1.

Petr

Ozan wrote:

> There are certainly Hijazi maqam elements after about 6:00.

Maybe one of the contributing factors is the mode to which I was
limiting the sounds used in the „solos“. It is the 7-tone scale of
13/12, 5/4, 4/3, 3/2, 13/8, 11/6, 2/1.

Unless it can be found somewhere, but I have no idea, this is exactly
what I call a "Hijazira" (Hijaz-Mohajira...).
Well done Petr ! nice roots, and good spices -
- - - -
Jak

A delayed Christmas present for the TL people

🔗Petr Pařízek <p.parizek@...>

🔗Marcel de Velde <m.develde@...>

🔗Petr Parízek <p.parizek@...>

🔗Carl Lumma <carl@...>

🔗Daniel Forro <dan.for@...>

🔗Carl Lumma <carl@...>

🔗Ozan Yarman <ozanyarman@...>

🔗Daniel Forro <dan.for@...>

🔗Danny Wier <dawiertx@...>

🔗Petr Pařízek <p.parizek@...>

🔗Jacques Dudon <fotosonix@...>