IMO-2

Dear friends,

Charles Lucy has added four questions/doubts to what Michael stated regarding my post (IMO) sent last 11/20.

Charles'questions and my answers follow:

<********3. Can this tuning system infinitely modulate and <transpose?******

Since 12 ET is able to modulate and transpose (I am not sure about the meaning of "modulate" and "transpose") since this scale was derived from a simple arithmetical operation, I suppose that JUSTHARM scale, the name of the three new scales, can also do it. The term "infinitely" could have been excluded in the question..

<********4. Can it emulate all imaginable musical scales?<*********

Emulation is not a respectable future for a scale that still is being evaluated and almost nobody knows its features. "Emulation", "All imaginable musical scales" !!, a dose of undefined terms begins to appear: I suspect that I didn't pray to St. Charles.

<********5. Can it produce and control both consonance and <dissonance?******

No one scale controls consonance and dissonance. If we tune a piano to a PERFECT SCALE, neither Mephistopheles would impede that the player plays what we call dissonant chords 24 hours a day, actually they do not deserve to be called that way. The dissonant effect that you are probably referring to, precisely comes from the particular amplitude distribution of harmonic components presented by the piano itself. The JUSTHARM scale consonance production is granted since its foundations rely on K and P semitone factors and M, J commas.

<********6. Are the harmonic "rules" it uses "practical" and easily understood? <*******

IMO harmonic rules should not exist. Physics showed that harmonic parameters obey to physical characteristics of the instrument which have no relation with music but they improve its expression. If you replace the piano strings or the hammers, you will notice that harmonic components or overtones have changed; each new partial percentage, or most of them, varied despite the scale is the same.

I spent some time trying to understand what makes the difference between a practical and a non-practical harmonic rules. Fourier integral and Fourier analysis explain all about it.

Thanks

Mario Pizarro

Lima, November 22, 2009
piagui@ec-red.com

>If you replace the piano strings or the hammers,
you will notice that harmonic components or overtones have changed; each
new partial percentage, or most of them, varied despite the scale is the
same.
This seems to refer a lot to Sethares' theories on consonance/dissonance (at least concerning the frequency spectrum as analyzed in FFTs)...and, for the record, I agree: you can never optimize harmonic rules to be "perfect" for all instruments...when you optimize them better for one type of instrument, they become worse for another.

On the other hand, I think Charles was talking about harmonic rules meaning "the rules that define which combination(s) of notes can/will make consonant chords". And, for the sake of accessibility to the public, I agree such rules should ideally be fairly simple.

________________________________
From: Mario Pizarro <piagui@...>
To: tuning yahoogroups <tuning@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sun, November 22, 2009 2:10:30 PM
Subject: [tuning] IMO-2

Dear friends,

Charles Lucy has added four
questions/doubts to what Michael stated regarding my post (IMO) sent last 11/20.

Charles'questions and my answers follow:

<********3. Can this tuning
system infinitely modulate and <transpose?** ****

Since 12
ET is able to modulate and transpose (I am not sure about the meaning of
"modulate" and "transpose") since this scale was derived from a simple
arithmetical operation, I suppose that JUSTHARM scale, the name of the three new
scales, can also do it. The term
"infinitely" could have been excluded in the question..

<********4. Can it emulate all
imaginable musical scales?<*********

Emulation
is not a respectable future for a scale that still is being evaluated and
almost nobody knows its features. "Emulation", "All imaginable musical scales"
!!, a dose of undefined terms begins to appear:
I suspect that I didn't pray to St. Charles.

<********5. Can it produce and
control both consonance and <dissonance?* *****

No one scale controls consonance
and dissonance. If we tune a piano to a
PERFECT SCALE, neither Mephistopheles would impede
that the player plays what we call dissonant chords 24 hours a
day, actually they do not deserve to be called that way. The dissonant
effect that you are probably referring to, precisely comes from the particular
amplitude distribution of harmonic components presented by the piano
itself. The JUSTHARM scale consonance production is granted
since its foundations rely on K and P semitone factors and M, J commas.

<********6. Are the harmonic "rules" it
uses "practical" and easily understood? <*******

IMO harmonic
rules should not exist. Physics showed that harmonic parameters obey to
physical characteristics of the instrument which have no relation with music but
they improve its expression. If you replace the piano strings or the hammers,
you will notice that harmonic components or overtones have changed; each
new partial percentage, or most of them, varied despite the scale is the
same.

I spent
some time trying to understand what makes the difference between a
practical and a non-practical harmonic rules. Fourier integral and Fourier
analysis explain all about it.

Thanks

Mario
Pizarro

Lima, November 22,
2009
piagui@ec-red. com