12EDO "Tonality": 3 Viennese "Stooges" vs the Rolling Stones:

Sorry, folks, but if I have gained any inspiration/insight
into what I consider the still undiscovered/untapped tonality
potential of the 12EDO tuning system, it was from the music of
the Rolling Stones, and NOT the diatonic idiot-savant noodlings
of the 3 Viennese "Stooges" (Bach, Mozart, and Beethoven).

Could it be my ethnicity (Anglo-Saxon [specifically Scottish/Welsh])
or my earliest listening background (the Beach Boys)?

I'll try and delve into this more precisely under more specific
subject headings.

Bill Flavell

Whaaat? idiot-savant noodlings? Viennese Stooges????

Holy peppers!

Oz.

P.S. Scots are not Anglo-saxonian in origin. They are the descendents of
Celts, hence, the misnomer: "Celtic Fringe".

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Flavell" <bill_flavell@email.com>
To: <tuning@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: 24 Aral�k 2005 Cumartesi 23:45
Subject: [tuning] 12EDO "Tonality": 3 Viennese "Stooges" vs the Rolling
Stones:

>
> Sorry, folks, but if I have gained any inspiration/insight
> into what I consider the still undiscovered/untapped tonality
> potential of the 12EDO tuning system, it was from the music of
> the Rolling Stones, and NOT the diatonic idiot-savant noodlings
> of the 3 Viennese "Stooges" (Bach, Mozart, and Beethoven).
>
> Could it be my ethnicity (Anglo-Saxon [specifically Scottish/Welsh])
> or my earliest listening background (the Beach Boys)?
>
> I'll try and delve into this more precisely under more specific
> subject headings.
>
>
> Bill Flavell
>
>

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Ozan Yarman" <ozanyarman@o...> wrote:
>
> Whaaat? idiot-savant noodlings?

Yes, Ox, that's what it sounds like to me!

Utterly formless and structureless "noodling"! :)

>Viennese Stooges????

Yes, in the sense that those 3 morons are still
dominating classical FM radio, as if Lizst, Wagner,
and Rimsky-Korsakov never existed! :)
>
> Holy peppers!
>
> Oz.
>
> P.S. Scots are not Anglo-saxonian in origin. They are the
descendents of
> Celts, hence, the misnomer: "Celtic Fringe".

Interesting! Thanks for that ethnicity info! :) I should be more aware
of my ethnic background/heritage! :)

Bill Flavell

> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Ozan Yarman" <ozanyarman@o...> wrote:
> >
> > Whaaat? idiot-savant noodlings?
>
> Yes, Ox, that's what it sounds like to me!
>

It's the meaning behind those words that I found horrifyingly unbelievable.

And mind you the X key on that sticky keyboard of yours. I may be as grand
as a pachyderm, but surely I have claims to being a little bit more sentient
than that!

> Utterly formless and structureless "noodling"! :)
>

Aie, your case is far worse than I thought.

> >Viennese Stooges????
>
> Yes, in the sense that those 3 morons are still
> dominating classical FM radio, as if Lizst, Wagner,
> and Rimsky-Korsakov never existed! :)
> >

I wouldn't call 'em morons 'tis close to xmas if I were ya. Scrooge might
snitch the word to Santa and then you would get only coal dust in your
stockings! har har har...

Besides, the real morons are then the radio-people who think that B/M/B
are all there is to Classical/Baroque music. Why should we blame the poor
composers who existed prior to the invention of even the transistor wire for
unscrupulous consumerism?

> >
> > P.S. Scots are not Anglo-saxonian in origin. They are the
> descendents of
> > Celts, hence, the misnomer: "Celtic Fringe".
>
> Interesting! Thanks for that ethnicity info! :) I should be more aware
> of my ethnic background/heritage! :)
>

If youse a Scot as ya claim to be, youse no Saxon fer sure!

>
> Bill Flavell
>
>
>

Cordially,
OZ with a capital(ist) Z

Hi Bill,

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Flavell" <bill_flavell@e...> wrote:

> >Viennese Stooges????
>
> Yes, in the sense that those 3 morons are still
> dominating classical FM radio, as if Lizst, Wagner,
> and Rimsky-Korsakov never existed! :)

Just because FM radio programmers think they can get
the most listeners -- and, therefore, the most
advertising dollars -- from Bach, Mozart, and Beethoven,
doesn't make those three composers "morons".

This is similar to blaming Schoenberg for the way
legions of academics after him straght-jacketed
musicians into using 12-edo, holding Schoenberg up
as the High Priest of 12-edo. He had some great
ideas, but he wasn't the one who encouraged a whole
century of students to follow him.

-monz
http://tonalsoft.com
Tonescape microtonal music software

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Flavell" <bill_flavell@e...> wrote:
>
>
> Sorry, folks, but if I have gained any inspiration/insight
> into what I consider the still undiscovered/untapped tonality
> potential of the 12EDO tuning system, it was from the music of
> the Rolling Stones, and NOT the diatonic idiot-savant noodlings
> of the 3 Viennese "Stooges" (Bach, Mozart, and Beethoven).

Any one of those three has more music in his little finger than you
have dreamed of in your philosophy. All this proves is that you don't
know what the hell you are talking about.

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Flavell" <bill_flavell@e...> wrote:
>
> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Ozan Yarman" <ozanyarman@o...> wrote:
> >
> > Whaaat? idiot-savant noodlings?
>
> Yes, Ox, that's what it sounds like to me!

Which means you haven't learned to listen. If you don't know a
subject, it's best to stay silent about it, or ask questions.

> Utterly formless and structureless "noodling"! :)

Actually, care in constructing large-scale structures is precisely
what Haydn, Mozart and Beethoven are famous for. This is like accusing
Vermeer of being an abstract expressionist.

Since when is Bach from Vienna anyway???

___________________________________________
PaulB Greenhaw
Music SpecialistB II
TheB NewB YorkB PublicB Library forB theB PerformingB Arts
40B LincolnB Center Plaza
NewB York,B NYB 10023
(212)B 870-1892
__________________________________________

-----tuning@yahoogroups.com wrote: -----

> To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
From: "Gene Ward Smith"
Sent by: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Date: 12/25/2005 09:46AM
Subject: [tuning] Re: 12EDO "Tonality": 3 Viennese "Stooges" vs the Rolling
Stones:

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Flavell" wrote:
>
>
> Sorry, folks, but if I have gained any inspiration/insight
> into what I consider the still undiscovered/untapped tonality
>; potential of the 12EDO tuning system, it was from the music of
> the Rolling Stones, and NOT the diatonic idiot-savant noodlings
> of the 3 Viennese "Stooges" (Bach, Mozart, and Beethoven).

Any one of those three has more music in his little finger than you
have dreamed of in your philosophy. All this proves is that you don't
know what the hell you are talking about.