Seven limit temperaments with actual music

What are the seven-limit rank two temperaments which have actually
been used? If someone can add to or correct this list, it would be
interesting.

Ennealimmal: GWS

Meantone: Cast of thousands

Magic: GWS, who else?

Beep: Herman Miller?

Pajara: Paul Erlich

Garibaldi: Garibaldi and who else?

Miracle: Pehrson, GWS, who else?

Orwell: GWS

Father: Herman

Mavila: Herman, GWS

Flattone: Aaron Johnson

Waage: Waage, I presume?

Gene Ward Smith wrote:
> What are the seven-limit rank two temperaments which have actually
> been used? If someone can add to or correct this list, it would be
> interesting.

Define "used". :-)

I had my DX7II tuned to keemun[11] for some time, before I ran across lemba. I did a keemun[11] arrangement of my "Scarecrow's Song" (i.e. the 8-note melody I came up with to teach to the scarecrow when I was playing the game Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time -- each player can come up with their own melody using the notes D, F, A, B, D in any order).

http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/sinka.mid

I have some other fragments of similar length in this tuning.

Currently my keyboard is tuned to a 24-note subset of lemba[26]. I've written some short bits of music in lemba[16].

"Galticeran" is in augmented temperament, originally 12-ET, but I've retuned it to other augmented tunings: 21-ET, 27-ET, and TOP.

http://www.io.com/~hmiller/midi/galticeran-top-augmented.mid

> Beep: Herman Miller?

I've written in this tuning, but I'm not sure whether the sample that I put up on my web page is in the 5-limit or 7-limit version. At any rate, "tetrads" in this temperament sound like sixth chords, so its debatable whether it should count as a 7-limit temperament.

> Miracle: Pehrson, GWS, who else?

I did this little bit in blackjack (miracle[21]):

ftp://ftp.io.com/pub/usr/hmiller/music/jack.mp3

and I've also explored miracle[31] (although I don't have any audio samples at the moment).

> Mavila: Herman, GWS

5-limit mavila, yes, but you need to be specific about the 7-limit extension. I've written in hexadecimal and superpelog:

http://home.comcast.net/~teamouse/gargoyle-16et.mp3
http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/mahali.mid

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:
>
> Gene Ward Smith wrote:
> > What are the seven-limit rank two temperaments which have actually
> > been used? If someone can add to or correct this list, it would be
> > interesting.
>
> Define "used". :-)

Stuff I could put up links to on a web page, mainly. Would you regard
Mizarian as 7-limit porcupine, by the way?

Gene Ward Smith wrote:
> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:
> >>Gene Ward Smith wrote:
>>
>>>What are the seven-limit rank two temperaments which have actually
>>>been used? If someone can add to or correct this list, it would be
>>>interesting.
>>
>>Define "used". :-)
> > > Stuff I could put up links to on a web page, mainly. Would you regard
> Mizarian as 7-limit porcupine, by the way?

As far as I know, the parts that are porcupine are 5-limit, and the parts that go beyond 5-limit aren't in porcupine temperament. I wasn't thinking in terms of porcupine temperament as such, since that hadn't been "discovered" yet.

Herman Miller wrote:

> Currently my keyboard is tuned to a 24-note subset of lemba[26]. I've > written some short bits of music in lemba[16].

Here's the links to the lemba samples if you're collecting web links.
http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/lemba.mid
http://www.io.com/~hmiller/midi/lemba2.mid

Indeed -- what the hell does USED mean?B If simply creating aB 1 min., insipid
midi file warrants a pitch-set as being "used," then hell.... it seems many
people have probably used themB P

___________________________________________
PaulB Greenhaw
MusicB SpecialistB II
TheB New YorkB PublicB LibraryB forB theB PerformingB Arts
40B LincolnB CenterB Plaza
NewB York,B NYB 10023
(212)B 870-1892
__________________________________________

-----tuning@yahoogroups.com wrote: -----

> To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
From: Herman Miller
Sent by: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Date: 12/11/2005 05:15PM
Subject: Re: [tuning] Seven limit temperaments with actual music

Gene Ward Smith wrote:
> What are the seven-limit rank two temperaments which have actually
> been used? If someone can add to or correct this list, it would be
> interesting.

Define "used". :-)

Indeed -- what the hell does USED mean? If simply creating a 1 min., insipid midi file warrants a pitch-set as being "used," then hell.... it seems many people have probably used them
Indeed--do you have any one-minute insipid midi files you care to give as examples?

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:

> As far as I know, the parts that are porcupine are 5-limit, and the
> parts that go beyond 5-limit aren't in porcupine temperament. I wasn't
> thinking in terms of porcupine temperament as such, since that hadn't
> been "discovered" yet.

And you weren' writing in 22 or 37-et which would have inclined you in
that direction anyway.

I have quite a few audio files -- not midi -- mp3s -- I've tried uploading to
the yahoo group's folder.... but there wasn't enough room.B
__________________________________________

-----tuning@yahoogroups.com wrote: -----

> To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
From: "Gene Ward Smith"
Sent by: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Date: 12/12/2005 05:33PM
Subject: [tuning] Re: Seven limit temperaments with actual music

Indeed -- what the hell does USED mean?B If simply creating aB 1 min., insipid
midi file warrants a pitch-set as being "used," then hell.... it seems many
people have probably used them
Indeed--do you have any one-minute insipid midi files you care to give as
examples?

> From: pgreenhaw@...
> Date: Tue Dec 13, 2005 8:36 am
> Subject: Re: [tuning] Re: Seven limit temperaments with actual music
>
> I have quite a few audio files -- not midi -- mp3s -- I've
> tried uploading to the yahoo group's folder.... but there
> wasn't enough room.

The Files section of this list was filled up long ago.
We created another Yahoo group (tuning_files) just for the
purpose of holding files, and it too is now full, so i created
yet another one a while back:

/tuning_files2/

I think it's still completely empty. Just sign up for membership
and you can put your mp3's there.

Note that or etiquette here accepts smaller mp3s but
encourages owners of large mp3s to store them on a website
somewhere instead, especially if you have a lot of them.
We're happy to put microtonal mp3's online on the Tonalsoft
website -- just write me offlist for info.

For the latter case, another alternative is to put them
into the Files section temporarily, with a notice that they
will be deleted after a week or so.

-monz
http://tonalsoft.com
Tonescape microtonal music software

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "monz" <monz@t...> wrote:

> The Files section of this list was filled up long ago.
> We created another Yahoo group (tuning_files) just for the
> purpose of holding files, and it too is now full, so i created
> yet another one a while back:
>
> /tuning_files2/

Tuning files is 89% full, out of 20 megabytes. That leaves plenty of
room for midi files.

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:
>
> Gene Ward Smith wrote:
> > What are the seven-limit rank two temperaments which have actually
> > been used? If someone can add to or correct this list, it would be
> > interesting.
>
> Define "used". :-)
>
> I had my DX7II tuned to keemun[11] for some time, before I ran
across
> lemba. I did a keemun[11] arrangement of my "Scarecrow's Song"
(i.e. the
> 8-note melody I came up with to teach to the scarecrow when I was
> playing the game Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time -- each player
can
> come up with their own melody using the notes D, F, A, B, D in any
order).
>
> http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/sinka.mid

I'm think my soundcard is playing this in 12-equal. That happens to
me with some of your files, Herman.

> "Galticeran" is in augmented temperament, originally 12-ET, but
I've
> retuned it to other augmented tunings: 21-ET, 27-ET, and TOP.
>
> http://www.io.com/~hmiller/midi/galticeran-top-augmented.mid

Cool! In the 7-limit, we have two distinct augmented mappings, and
thus we have TOP Augene and TOP August. Is this one of those, or the
5-limit version?

> ftp://ftp.io.com/pub/usr/hmiller/music/jack.mp3

This is taking forever to load . . .

> and I've also explored miracle[31] (although I don't have any audio
> samples at the moment).
>
> > Mavila: Herman, GWS
>
> 5-limit mavila, yes, but you need to be specific about the 7-limit
> extension. I've written in hexadecimal and superpelog:
>
> http://home.comcast.net/~teamouse/gargoyle-16et.mp3

Nice! Does it count if you compose in 16-equal, Gene?

> http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/mahali.mid

I'm pretty sure my soundcard is playing this in 12-equal.

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:
>
> Herman Miller wrote:
>
> > Currently my keyboard is tuned to a 24-note subset of lemba[26].
I've
> > written some short bits of music in lemba[16].
>
> Here's the links to the lemba samples if you're collecting web links.
> http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/lemba.mid

I'm pretty sure this is playing in 12-equal on my soundcard.

> http://www.io.com/~hmiller/midi/lemba2.mid

Ditto.

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "wallyesterpaulrus"
<wallyesterpaulrus@y...> wrote:

> > 5-limit mavila, yes, but you need to be specific about the 7-limit
> > extension. I've written in hexadecimal and superpelog:
> >
> > http://home.comcast.net/~teamouse/gargoyle-16et.mp3
>
> Nice! Does it count if you compose in 16-equal, Gene?

I'd call it hexidecimal. 7-limit pelogic is more like what happens
when you take 9-edo, and suffer from the delusion it has fifths.

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "wallyesterpaulrus"
<wallyesterpaulrus@y...> wrote:

> > http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/mahali.mid
>
> I'm pretty sure my soundcard is playing this in 12-equal.

The pitch bends are all collected at the end of the file, which might
mean different midi players play it differently. I think a listening
comparison would be worthwhile.

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Ward Smith" <gwsmith@s...> wrote:

> I'd call it hexidecimal. 7-limit pelogic is more like what happens
> when you take 9-edo, and suffer from the delusion it has fifths.

I meant "mavila".

wallyesterpaulrus wrote:
> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:
> >>Herman Miller wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Currently my keyboard is tuned to a 24-note subset of lemba[26]. > > I've > >>>written some short bits of music in lemba[16].
>>
>>Here's the links to the lemba samples if you're collecting web links.
>>http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/lemba.mid
> > > I'm pretty sure this is playing in 12-equal on my soundcard.

Hmm, this is another one that's been tuned with Scala (with the tuning in a separate track from the actual notes). I have a more recent version of this with the tuning in the individual tracks.

>>http://www.io.com/~hmiller/midi/lemba2.mid
> > > Ditto.

I'll see if I can find the original untuned file of this one and redo it with Midiconv.....

wallyesterpaulrus wrote:
> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:
>>http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/sinka.mid
> > > I'm think my soundcard is playing this in 12-equal. That happens to > me with some of your files, Herman.

Yes, I wasn't aware until recently that Scala-tuned files are a problem. The older ones are tuned with Midiconv (from Graham Breed's web page), but there may still be a few more of these Scala-tuned files around. I'm having trouble finding the original unretuned version of this file, but if I run across it, I'll see if I can figure out what tuning I used so that I can retune it with Midiconv.

>>"Galticeran" is in augmented temperament, originally 12-ET, but > > I've > >>retuned it to other augmented tunings: 21-ET, 27-ET, and TOP.
>>
>>http://www.io.com/~hmiller/midi/galticeran-top-augmented.mid
> > > Cool! In the 7-limit, we have two distinct augmented mappings, and > thus we have TOP Augene and TOP August. Is this one of those, or the > 5-limit version?

It has some 7-limit content, and if I'm reading this correctly, the 7:4 interval B-A is equivalent to 9:5, which is consistent with August (36:35 comma) but not Augene. The original 12-ET and my favorite version 21-ET are both consistent with this temperament.

! 12 notes of TOP Augmented (Galticeran scale)
coords 3
octave 0.999980525
fifth 0.577227706
third 0.333326841
notes 12
0 0 0 0 ! C
1 -2 3 1 ! C#
2 -1 2 0 ! D
3 0 1 -1 ! Eb
4 0 0 1 ! E
5 -1 3 -1 ! F
6 -1 2 1 ! F#
7 0 1 0 ! G
8 1 0 -1 ! Ab
9 -1 3 0 ! A
10 0 2 -1 ! Bb
11 0 1 1 ! B
12 1 0 0 ! C

>>http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/mahali.mid
> > > I'm pretty sure my soundcard is playing this in 12-equal.

I do have the original unretuned version of this one. If I can figure out the exact tuning, I'll redo it with Midiconv.

wallyesterpaulrus wrote:
>>http://www.io.com/~hmiller/midi/lemba2.mid
> > > Ditto.

I put up an mp3 of this one also (since it's faster than redoing the MIDI file).

http://www.io.com/~hmiller/mp3/lemba2.mp3

Herman Miller wrote:
> wallyesterpaulrus wrote:
> >>--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:
>>
>>>http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/sinka.mid
>>
>>
>>I'm think my soundcard is playing this in 12-equal. That happens to >>me with some of your files, Herman.
> > > Yes, I wasn't aware until recently that Scala-tuned files are a problem. > The older ones are tuned with Midiconv (from Graham Breed's web page), > but there may still be a few more of these Scala-tuned files around. I'm > having trouble finding the original unretuned version of this file, but > if I run across it, I'll see if I can figure out what tuning I used so > that I can retune it with Midiconv.
> Okay, I found the original version and used Midiconv to retune it. Try it now:

http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/sinka.mid

Herman Miller wrote:
>>>http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/mahali.mid
>>
>>
>>I'm pretty sure my soundcard is playing this in 12-equal.
> > > I do have the original unretuned version of this one. If I can figure > out the exact tuning, I'll redo it with Midiconv.

Well, I figured out the tuning, but it requires more than 15 MIDI tracks, so I can't use Midiconv on it. So here's a quick rendering with Absynth 3 (using some timbres I've been working on for lemba music, which still manage to sound pretty reasonable in this tuning...)

http://www.io.com/~hmiller/mp3/mahali.mp3

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:

> Yes, I wasn't aware until recently that Scala-tuned files are a
problem.

The problem is really with the midi player, not Scala.

Hi Gene.
You wrote:

> The problem is really with the midi player, not Scala.

The MIDI files Scala creates do not SMF1 conditions properly. In the correct
SMF1, there is only one channel per track. Scala puts data for more channels
on one track, which may cause trouble. See my last message.
Petr

> The problem is really with the midi player, not Scala.

> The MIDI files Scala creates do not SMF1 conditions properly. In the
correct
> SMF1, there is only one channel per track. Scala puts data for more
channels
> on one track, which may cause trouble. See my last message.
> Petr

If that were done, the original track structure would be totally
mixed up because of the pitch bend channel swapping.
I don't know what the rationale is for this SMF1 limitation, possibly
to make the implementation of midi players easier.
So I have no plan to change this, if a midi player causes trouble one
can use another, or use Günther Nagler's tools to modify the file.

Manuel

Hello Manuel.
You wrote:

> If that were done, the original track structure would be totally
> mixed up because of the pitch bend channel swapping.

Sadly, I must admit I don't understand what you mean.

> I don't know what the rationale is for this SMF1 limitation, possibly
> to make the implementation of midi players easier.

The difference is that SMF0 has only one track containing all the
information about the whole piece, while SMF1 should have as many tracks as
there are MIDI channels used, which allows keeping the channel data separate
and preventing messing them up. Score writing programs often ask for SMF1
when converting MIDI data to standard notation. This is mainly right for
this reason as the program requires the imported data to be in such a format
that keeps channel data separate. Since Scala has to use different output
channels when retuning using pitch-bends, this isn't a very appropriate
condition. In this case, the only solution is to convert the output file to
SMF0 externally, and then eventually back to SMF1, if needed.

> So I have no plan to change this

Well, in fact, you actually don't have to as you yourself suggested a
possible solution. I've tried it out, it works, so we've found the way. If
the user reads the Scala documentation carefully, they should be able to
solve the problem themselves. You did mention it there so I think you've
done your best so far for this matter. Now it's up to others how much they
care. I do.
Petr

Petr Par�zek wrote:

> The difference is that SMF0 has only one track containing all the
> information about the whole piece, while SMF1 should have as many tracks as
> there are MIDI channels used, which allows keeping the channel data separate
> and preventing messing them up. Score writing programs often ask for SMF1
> when converting MIDI data to standard notation. This is mainly right for
> this reason as the program requires the imported data to be in such a format
> that keeps channel data separate. Since Scala has to use different output
> channels when retuning using pitch-bends, this isn't a very appropriate
> condition. In this case, the only solution is to convert the output file to
> SMF0 externally, and then eventually back to SMF1, if needed.

For those of us without access to the official MIDI standard, perhaps you could quote the part that says format 1 files must have a single channel per track. No unofficial reference I've ever seen mentions this. The de facto standard certainly ignores it, because it's commonplace for sequencers to allow you to record all channels in a single track (although not usually in a very convenient manner).

Yes, score writing programs ask for format 1 because that's the right thing to do. It tells them what stave to put each piece on. The channel numbers can't tell you this because you may have a MIDI guitar outputting to 6 different channels, for example. But hey, maybe they smoked some really good crack when the drew up the standard and made the tracks completely redundant. Fortunately most people ignore them in that case.

MIDI Relay puts multiple channels into a track. If anybody's having trouble with Scala but not MIDI Relay there must be something else going wrong.

Graham

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:
>
> wallyesterpaulrus wrote:
> >>http://www.io.com/~hmiller/midi/lemba2.mid
> >
> >
> > Ditto.
>
> I put up an mp3 of this one also (since it's faster than redoing the
> MIDI file).
>
> http://www.io.com/~hmiller/mp3/lemba2.mp3

Cool -- but it sounds almost *too* consonant to be in Lemba! Is this
TOP Lemba, or . . . (?)

wallyesterpaulrus wrote:

>>http://www.io.com/~hmiller/mp3/lemba2.mp3
> > > Cool -- but it sounds almost *too* consonant to be in Lemba! Is this > TOP Lemba, or . . . (?)

Actually, I believe this is golden lemba (just 2:1 octaves, ratio of large to small steps = the golden ratio). Start with Wilson's horagram no. 22 (generator = phi / 2 phi + 1) and divide all the interval sizes in half. But the MIDI file is in TOP lemba[16].

http://www.io.com/~hmiller/midi/lemba2.mid (should work now...)

On Wed, 14 Dec 2005, "wallyesterpaulrus" wrote:
>
> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:
> >
> > Herman Miller wrote:
> >
> > > Currently my keyboard is tuned to a 24-note subset of lemba[26].
> > > I've written some short bits of music in lemba[16].
> >
> > Here's the links to the lemba samples if you're collecting web links.
> > http://www.io.com/~hmiller/music/ex/lemba.mid
>
> I'm pretty sure this is playing in 12-equal on my soundcard.
>
> > http://www.io.com/~hmiller/midi/lemba2.mid
>
> Ditto.

Definitely NOT 12-EDO on my keyboard nor on my
"soundcard" (Creative-compatible motherboard
chipset).

I enjoyed these small pieces greatly last time I heard
them, and I think lemba[16] could definitely grow on
one.

Regards,
Yahya
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.1/204 - Release Date: 15/12/05

>Is Manuel around? He doesn't seem to be answering on this list, but
>only on others . . . :(

Yes, but not reading all the posts.

Which midi player do you use? With Megamid you're always safe. Perhaps the
difference with midiconv is that the pitch bend messages are in a separate
track and therefore wrongly ignored.

Manuel

coul@hccnet.nl wrote:

> Which midi player do you use? With Megamid you're always safe. Perhaps the
> difference with midiconv is that the pitch bend messages are in a separate
> track and therefore wrongly ignored.

Midiconv puts the pitch bends in the same track as the notes, with a pitch bend for each note except for octave doubling. That means it doesn't have to worry about the timing.

Graham

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, coul@h... wrote:
>
> >Is Manuel around? He doesn't seem to be answering on this list, but
> >only on others . . . :(
>
> Yes, but not reading all the posts.

Sorry Manuel,

Someone -- was it Kalle? -- was discussing a BP pentatonic, which I
think you should add to your list of modes, and I mentioned that
Igliashon Jones, who liked my Porcupine idea in 22-equal, gravitated
toward the 8-note modes and perhaps we should list 33133333 with his
name as well (Igs, are you around at the moment)?

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "wallyesterpaulrus"
<wallyesterpaulrus@y...> wrote:
>
> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, coul@h... wrote:
> >
> > >Is Manuel around? He doesn't seem to be answering on this list, but
> > >only on others . . . :(
> >
> > Yes, but not reading all the posts.
>
> Sorry Manuel,
>
> Someone -- was it Kalle? -- was discussing a BP pentatonic, which I

Yep, that was me.

> think you should add to your list of modes, and I mentioned that
> Igliashon Jones, who liked my Porcupine idea in 22-equal, gravitated
> toward the 8-note modes and perhaps we should list 33133333 with his
> name as well (Igs, are you around at the moment)?

But those modes are already added here:

http://www.xs4all.nl/~huygensf/doc/modename.html

Kalle

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Kalle Aho" <kalleaho@m...> wrote:
>
> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "wallyesterpaulrus"
> <wallyesterpaulrus@y...> wrote:
> >
> > --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, coul@h... wrote:
> > >
> > > >Is Manuel around? He doesn't seem to be answering on this
list, but
> > > >only on others . . . :(
> > >
> > > Yes, but not reading all the posts.
> >
> > Sorry Manuel,
> >
> > Someone -- was it Kalle? -- was discussing a BP pentatonic, which
I
>
> Yep, that was me.
>
> > think you should add to your list of modes, and I mentioned that
> > Igliashon Jones, who liked my Porcupine idea in 22-equal,
gravitated
> > toward the 8-note modes and perhaps we should list 33133333 with
his
> > name as well (Igs, are you around at the moment)?
>
>
> But those modes are already added here:
>
> http://www.xs4all.nl/~huygensf/doc/modename.html
>
>
> Kalle

Oh . . . I didn't know that had happened . . . thanks Manuel! I think
some cleaning-up should be done, though. For instance, under 22 we
have

3 4 3 3 3 3 3 Twenty-two tone Miller's Porcupine-7 Major
3 3 1 3 3 3 3 3 Twenty-two tone Jones's Porcupine-8

But under 15 we have

2 2 2 3 2 2 2 Fifteen-tone Miller's Porcupine-7
2 3 2 2 2 2 2 Fifteen-tone Miller's Porcupine-7 Major

Is Herman comfortable with these "Major" and "Blank" mode names?
Shouldn't Igliashon's mode be listed under 15-equal too? And even if
I was the one who introduced Herman (?) and Igs to these modes, I
don't like a separate section with my name on it, especially when
this section only lists the "Blank" mode out of those above . . .

And this one:

1 3 1 1 3 1 3 1 1 3 1 3 Twenty-two tone Schismic

Is definitely wrong, isn't it? 22-equal isn't Schismic or Shismic or
Skhismatic or whatever you wanna callit . . .

wallyesterpaulrus wrote:
> > Oh . . . I didn't know that had happened . . . thanks Manuel! I think > some cleaning-up should be done, though. For instance, under 22 we > have
> > 3 4 3 3 3 3 3 Twenty-two tone Miller's Porcupine-7 Major > 3 3 1 3 3 3 3 3 Twenty-two tone Jones's Porcupine-8 > > But under 15 we have
> > 2 2 2 3 2 2 2 Fifteen-tone Miller's Porcupine-7 > 2 3 2 2 2 2 2 Fifteen-tone Miller's Porcupine-7 Major > > Is Herman comfortable with these "Major" and "Blank" mode names? > Shouldn't Igliashon's mode be listed under 15-equal too? And even if > I was the one who introduced Herman (?) and Igs to these modes, I > don't like a separate section with my name on it, especially when > this section only lists the "Blank" mode out of those above . . .

I don't recall having any names for these modes, although I've used the traditional mode names like "dorian" and "phrygian" informally for non-diatonic modes, so it's possible I might have called this one "major" at some point. The connection between temperaments and MOS scales wasn't clear to me when I was writing 15-ET music, and I've rarely used either of these modes. One 15-ET mode that I do have a name for is "kusiro", 1 3 2 3 1 1 2 2. I probably had other 15-ET mode names at one time, but I've moved a couple of times in the last few years and I'm not sure where all my notes are.

Is either of these the mode used in "Glassic"? That would be a good name for the mode if it is.

Paul wrote:
>Is Herman comfortable with these "Major" and "Blank" mode names?
>Shouldn't Igliashon's mode be listed under 15-equal too?

Yes, I've done so now.
http://www.xs4all.nl/~huygensf/doc/modename.html

>1 3 1 1 3 1 3 1 1 3 1 3 Twenty-two tone Schismic

>Is definitely wrong, isn't it? 22-equal isn't Schismic or Shismic or
>Skhismatic or whatever you wanna callit . . .

Oh my mistake, thanks for catching it. So I've renamed it to
"Superpythagorean".

Manuel

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Herman Miller <hmiller@I...> wrote:
>
> wallyesterpaulrus wrote:
> >
> > Oh . . . I didn't know that had happened . . . thanks Manuel! I
think
> > some cleaning-up should be done, though. For instance, under 22
we
> > have
> >
> > 3 4 3 3 3 3 3 Twenty-two tone Miller's Porcupine-7 Major
> > 3 3 1 3 3 3 3 3 Twenty-two tone Jones's Porcupine-8
> >
> > But under 15 we have
> >
> > 2 2 2 3 2 2 2 Fifteen-tone Miller's Porcupine-7
> > 2 3 2 2 2 2 2 Fifteen-tone Miller's Porcupine-7 Major
> >
> > Is Herman comfortable with these "Major" and "Blank" mode names?
> > Shouldn't Igliashon's mode be listed under 15-equal too? And even
if
> > I was the one who introduced Herman (?) and Igs to these modes, I
> > don't like a separate section with my name on it, especially when
> > this section only lists the "Blank" mode out of those above . . .
>
> I don't recall having any names for these modes, although I've used
the
> traditional mode names like "dorian" and "phrygian" informally for
> non-diatonic modes, so it's possible I might have called this one
> "major" at some point. The connection between temperaments and MOS
> scales wasn't clear to me when I was writing 15-ET music, and I've
> rarely used either of these modes. One 15-ET mode that I do have a
name
> for is "kusiro", 1 3 2 3 1 1 2 2. I probably had other 15-ET mode
names
> at one time, but I've moved a couple of times in the last few years
and
> I'm not sure where all my notes are.
>
> Is either of these the mode used in "Glassic"? That would be a good
name
> for the mode if it is.

Good point. The beginning and ending of "Glassic", performed at the
second AFMM Microthon, is in the 4 3 3 3 3 3 3 mode. Part of
the "Modal Improv" Ara and I performed at the first AFMM Microthon
was in the 3 3 3 4 3 3 3 mode.