British Microfest

Thank you Graham for the play by play on the doings on your side of the pond.
The bigger perspective relative to Mark's concerns, is that an organization
is like a child: this new festival is only a two-year-old.

Yes, it's true that theirs is a bit myopic compared to programs with decades
to develop, but it is understandable.

In the virgin microtonal world, a quartertone is as sinister an invader into
norms as any other microtone. In fact, a quartertone is a gateway interval,
often leading to other distinctive microtonalalia.

Personal frustration and fairness are understandable as well. My sense is
that each geographical locale needs to first assert its base before opening up
to the greater microtonal world. Some set up sister cities.

best, Johnny Reinhard

On Thursday 20 October 2005 9:54 am, Afmmjr@aol.com wrote:

> In the virgin microtonal world, a quartertone is as sinister an invader
> into norms as any other microtone. In fact, a quartertone is a gateway
> interval, often leading to other distinctive microtonalalia.

it's funny, is the quartertone so popular because of the acedemic popularity
of composers like Carillo and Wyschenegradsky, or is it the multiple of 12
factor, or both, or none of the above?

i know that busoni wrote about 18; it thus seems (my tentative hypothesis, if
you will) that the whole idea of a 'tone' of 1/6 of an octave might be the
culprit: then the explorative mind seeks to divide *it* by simple integer
fractions, instead of exploring different sizes of tone.

in this way, this is another aspect of 12-equal being an 'industry standard'
tuning in a negtive way.

anyone have any other thoughts?

-aaron.

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Afmmjr@a... wrote:
>
> Thank you Graham for the play by play on the doings on your side of
> the pond.

Since we are at this - there is the following coming in my area:

http://www3.stzh.ch/internet/zuerichkultur/home/institutionen/home/redirect_tfnm/tage_fuer_neue_musik/home/programm.html

I got the impression that some of the composers are microtonal ones -
anybody knows the guys?
--
Hans Straub

> the whole idea of a 'tone' of 1/6 of an octave might be the
> culprit: then the explorative mind seeks to divide *it* by
> simple integer fractions, instead of exploring different
> sizes of tone.

Yup, this seems to have been a problem. Looking for notes
between the notes is the most instantly obvious thing to do.
But questioning the origin of the notes you have is the
better thing to do.

But I will say that I think 24 is a great system for making
music.

-Carl

Hi Aaron,

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Aaron Krister Johnson <aaron@a...> wrote:

> it's funny, is the quartertone so popular because of the
> acedemic popularity of composers like Carillo and
> Wyschenegradsky, or is it the multiple of 12 factor,
> or both, or none of the above?

I can't speak *too* authoritatively on academia (even
tho i think i'm an academe myself), since i dropped out
of college ... but i doubt seriously the weight of
"the acedemic popularity of composers like Carillo
and Wyschenegradsky". If a survey was done among
conservatory students, my guess is that less than 1%
of them have ever heard of either name. (Being a
microtonalist tends to skew one's perspective a bit ...)

Certainly the reason why quarter-tones are the most
usual "gateway" into microtonality is because 24-edo
is such an easy (in both concept and practice) extension
of the ubiquitous 12-edo -- i.e., the "multiple of 12 factor".

In fact, microtonalists of the early 1900s often used
precisely this aspect as an argument *for* the acceptance
of 24-edo, and thus, microtonality. Have you seen my
webpages containing an English translation of Moellendorf's
book? This was his angle, and he was a primary influence
on both Haba and Wyschnegradsky.

http://tonalsoft.com/monzo/moellendorf/book/contents.htm

> i know that busoni wrote about 18; it thus seems (my
> tentative hypothesis, if you will) that the whole idea
> of a 'tone' of 1/6 of an octave might be the culprit:
> then the explorative mind seeks to divide *it* by simple
> integer fractions, instead of exploring different sizes
> of tone.
>
> in this way, this is another aspect of 12-equal being
> an 'industry standard' tuning in a negtive way.
>
> anyone have any other thoughts?

I don't really see it as "negative" ... 24-edo is just
another avenue of microtonal exploration. Many tuning
theorists have denigrated it, but i'm glad that Carl
stands up for it and says he likes it.

(I wrote my _24-eq tune_ after reading lots of denigrations
by tuning-theorists, specifically to prove to myself
that 24-edo could be useful for composing a decent tune
.... and it turns out that Carl really likes it!)

http://sonic-arts.org/monzo/24-eq/24-eq.htm

Anyway, the point i wanted to make about these last
paragraphs of yours, is that 12-tone tunings have been
a part of musical history for a very, very long time.

Even if it hasn't been 12-edo, it can be documented that
the pythagorean-comma was recognized by the ancient Greeks,
and i'm certain that it was recognized all the way back
in c.2500 BC by the Sumerians. The pythagorean-comma's
2,3-monzo is |-19 12 >, which pretty much delineates
a 12-tone scale, no matter what tuning it actually is.
It's been with us humans for a long time.

-monz
http://tonalsoft.com
Tonescape microtonal music software

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "monz" <monz@t...> wrote:
>
> Hi Aaron,
>
>
> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Aaron Krister Johnson <aaron@a...>
wrote:
>
> > it's funny, is the quartertone so popular because of the
> > acedemic popularity of composers like Carillo and
> > Wyschenegradsky, or is it the multiple of 12 factor,
> > or both, or none of the above?
>
>
> I can't speak *too* authoritatively on academia (even
> tho i think i'm an academe myself), since i dropped out
> of college ... but i doubt seriously the weight of
> "the acedemic popularity of composers like Carillo
> and Wyschenegradsky". If a survey was done among
> conservatory students, my guess is that less than 1%
> of them have ever heard of either name. (Being a
> microtonalist tends to skew one's perspective a bit ...)

Perhaps. Wychnegradsky was the *only* microtonal composer the
chairman (a woman) of the Yale College (not the School of music)
music department had heard of when I was there . . .