Turkish tuning

Hey Ozan...I'm enjoying your posts on Turkish music and how maqams are tuned, and had a question: some years ago, I got a tape and press sheet from a great Turkish fretless guitarist named Erkan Ogur (do you know of him?), and in the letter he mentioned that Turkish music was based off the 53 tone eq system. And, he had been conservatory trained (but I don't recall where), so perhaps he had been taught that method where he studied. But, I get the impression from you thet 53 is not the whole story. So, my question is this: are different ideas of tuning taught at different schools in Turkey? As we know, European music is always taught according to the 12 eq system, with little or no discussion of any other systems...sounds like the situation may be different in Turkey. And, I really like what Can has done with his non deterministic concept, that makes a lot of sense to me. Is there any sort of move afoot over there to agree on one national Turkish system? And you may have talked about this in a past post, sorry if I missed it...it's an interesting subject. Thanks, best...HHH
microstick.net

Heya Neil!

----- Original Message -----
From: Neil Haverstick
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 01 Ekim 2005 Cumartesi 7:02
Subject: [tuning] Turkish tuning

Hey Ozan...I'm enjoying your posts on Turkish music and how maqams are tuned,

Thank you. Sorry I couldn't get back to you earlier. I am engrossed with a presentation I'm preparing for the symposium which will take place in Istanbul in a few days.

and had a question: some years ago, I got a tape and press sheet from a great Turkish fretless guitarist named Erkan Ogur (do you know of him?),

Yep, he had the frets of his guitar removed in order to be able to play microtones. He's a very able, talented musician.

and in the letter he mentioned that Turkish music was based off the 53 tone eq system.

I'm not surprised. This tuning has almost become a fetish here.

And, he had been conservatory trained (but I don't recall where),
so perhaps he had been taught that method where he studied. But, I get the impression from you thet 53 is not the whole story.

That is the case.

So, my question is this: are different ideas of tuning taught at different schools in Turkey?

The most prominent school is the Arel-Ezgi school. Alternatives to this are the Yekta school (just the notation part, since the pitches are exactly the same as those of the previous), Tore-Karadeniz school (41 out of 106-tET), Oransay (29-tone Pythagorean with a single exception), Yalcin Tura (JI quarter-tone), Muzaffer Sarisozen's saz fretting (17-tone hybrid?), Arabic 24-tET and lately other various petty tunings suggested by such people as Erol Sayan (30-tone Pythagorean? I'm not sure).

As we know, European music is always taught according to the 12 eq system, with little or no discussion of any other systems...sounds like the situation may be different in Turkey.

Turkey is no different in practicing musical bigotry and conservatorial clericalism as compared to the West. Is it because we wreck ourselves trying to be Western? Who knows? :)

And, I really like what Can has done with his non
deterministic concept, that makes a lot of sense to me.

Glad to hear that his achievements reverberate in the tuning list.

Is there any sort of move afoot over there to agree on one national Turkish system?

It's already largely agreed upon. It's the Arel-Ezgi system that monopolized most of the music institutions. Though I may not be able to thwart their dominion single-handedly, I shall nevertheless continue to propound facts I know to be right and justified.

And you may have talked about this in a past post, sorry if I missed it...it's an interesting subject. Thanks, best...HHH
microstick.net

Cordially,
Ozan