Perfect Pitch

Friday's newspaper had an article originally written by James Glanz
of the New York Times, citing a paper submitted to a meeting of the
Acoustical Society of America, by Diana Deutsch of UC San Diego. The
paper makes the case that perfect pitch is probably inborn, but is lost
unless one's language has pitch-inflected meaning, as do Vietnamese
and Mandarin Chinese, for example.

(The basis is that speakers read a list of words several days apart
yet achieved close match ("well within a semitone", whatever that means)
of pitch between the two readings).

I found the (very brief) abstract for this paper at:

http://asa.aip.org/web2/asa/abstracts/search.nov99/asa644.html

In passing, a claim was made (in the newspaper article, not the
abstract) that in the United States, as few as 1 in 10,000 adults have
perfect pitch. This seems WAY small to me, but perhaps refers to a more
precise perfect pitch than simply identifying the nearest 12-tET
note (?).

I have seen products advertised that alleged to help adults achieve
perfect pitch, and I have also heard that such products do not work.

Can any list members point me to more information on this subject?

JdL

Jay here,
I heard sn NPR feature on that article and I think the researcher is totally
off base unless some salient facts were not presented. Hitting the same
pitch in that sort of linguistic context, I betcha, has to do with trained
muscular memory in setting up the vocal chords. There are a lot of easier
ways to unearth pitch recognition, aren't there? I don't doubt that being
raised in a culture with a tonal language could encourage one's
pitch-recognition potential.
Here's a ponderable, just what, not why. I am blessed with "pitch
recognition" (I prefer to call it that). When I'm singing in a casual
manner, either to myself or to someone "in passing", I sing a given song in
whatever key happens to feel kumfy at the moment and intonation be slightly
damned. I often hear myself singing in a key somewhere between two
"standard" pitches, but feel no compunction to change it. I guess I mention
that to indicate that a sense of pitch may have little to do with the way
one chooses to use the voice.
At 02:16 PM 11/5/99 -0700, you wrote:
>From: "John A. deLaubenfels" <jadl@idcomm.com>
>
>
>Friday's newspaper had an article originally written by James Glanz
>of the New York Times, citing a paper submitted to a meeting of the
>Acoustical Society of America, by Diana Deutsch of UC San Diego. The
>paper makes the case that perfect pitch is probably inborn, but is lost
>unless one's language has pitch-inflected meaning, as do Vietnamese
>and Mandarin Chinese, for example.
>
>(The basis is that speakers read a list of words several days apart
>yet achieved close match ("well within a semitone", whatever that means)
>of pitch between the two readings).
>
>I found the (very brief) abstract for this paper at:
>
> http://asa.aip.org/web2/asa/abstracts/search.nov99/asa644.html
>
>In passing, a claim was made (in the newspaper article, not the
>abstract) that in the United States, as few as 1 in 10,000 adults have
>perfect pitch. This seems WAY small to me, but perhaps refers to a more
>precise perfect pitch than simply identifying the nearest 12-tET
>note (?).
>
>I have seen products advertised that alleged to help adults achieve
>perfect pitch, and I have also heard that such products do not work.
>
>Can any list members point me to more information on this subject?
>
>JdL
>
>>You do not need web access to participate. You may subscribe through
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>
>
>

John,

David L. Burge sells a taped course on perfect pitch. His number is (515)
472-3100. I don't remember why, but several years ago I bought the course
for $99 or so. I listened to one tape at most. I think that I might still
be eligible for a refund. I hope so.

Frankly, I find the concept of perfect pitch ludicrous. I want to work with
musicians who listen to what is happening and can relate to that, not to
their memory of some instrument that is not being played. So perfect pitch
is a skill that I would not care to develop. If any singer auditioning for
me claimed perfect pitch as one of his skills, I'd listen extra carefully
to how he sang in an ensemble. Would he sing the so-called correct pitches
if the rest of the ensemble drifted, or would he go with the ensemble? When
singing F in a Dmin7 chord and then in a G7 chord would he sing the same
pitch both times, or would he adjust according to harmonic context? I want
singers who do the latter in both cases, and I suspect that anyone claiming
perfect pitch might do the former.

On the other hand, when I've been intensely working on something I'm
singing, I can often find the starting note very accurately without first
hearing any reference pitch. More than once I have done this upon awakening
after a full night's sleep. I suspect that most people could do the same if
they worked at it. But so what? It is much more musically interesting for
an ensemble to learn how to sing a C7 b5 b9 b13 chord in tune. Perfect
pitch won't help with that.

John Link
ALMOST ACAPPELLA

>From: "John A. deLaubenfels" <jadl@idcomm.com>
>
>
>Friday's newspaper had an article originally written by James Glanz
>of the New York Times, citing a paper submitted to a meeting of the
>Acoustical Society of America, by Diana Deutsch of UC San Diego. The
>paper makes the case that perfect pitch is probably inborn, but is lost
>unless one's language has pitch-inflected meaning, as do Vietnamese
>and Mandarin Chinese, for example.
>
>(The basis is that speakers read a list of words several days apart
>yet achieved close match ("well within a semitone", whatever that means)
>of pitch between the two readings).
>
>I found the (very brief) abstract for this paper at:
>
> http://asa.aip.org/web2/asa/abstracts/search.nov99/asa644.html
>
>In passing, a claim was made (in the newspaper article, not the
>abstract) that in the United States, as few as 1 in 10,000 adults have
>perfect pitch. This seems WAY small to me, but perhaps refers to a more
>precise perfect pitch than simply identifying the nearest 12-tET
>note (?).
>
>I have seen products advertised that alleged to help adults achieve
>perfect pitch, and I have also heard that such products do not work.
>
>Can any list members point me to more information on this subject?
>
>JdL
>
>>You do not need web access to participate. You may subscribe through
>email. Send an empty email to one of these addresses:
> tuning-subscribe@onelist.com - subscribe to the tuning list.
> tuning-unsubscribe@onelist.com - unsubscribe from the tuning list.
> tuning-digest@onelist.com - switch your subscription to digest mode.
> tuning-normal@onelist.com - switch your subscription to normal mode.

I agree with Jay. The Chinese tonal languages are not precise pitches and so
there may not be that much of a basis with Perfect Pitch. They are
vocalizing within a bandwidth which does not sit right with the Perfect Pitch
digital capture of a pitch. There are likely other pitch memory strategies
involved. Tone-deaf Chinese have no trouble speaking their language, for
instance.

Johnny Reinhard
AFMM

>From: Jay Williams <jaywill@utah-inter.net>
>..... When I'm singing in a casual
>manner, either to myself or to someone "in passing", I sing a given song in
>whatever key happens to feel kumfy at the moment and intonation be slightly
>damned. I often hear myself singing in a key somewhere between two
>"standard" pitches, but feel no compunction to change it.

Jay,

Your intonation need be damned only if the pitches you sing don't relate
correctly to each other. As long as they relate correctly to each other you
are in tune!

John Link
ALMOST ACAPPELLA

Jay here,
Those of you who think that "perfect pitch" would be more of an obstacle
than a help are partially right in that, having any pronounced talent has
its down side. A certain willful adjustment is necessary on the part of
anyone with a talent if functionality is desired. When I was young, after
being made aware of my ability in relation to a specific set of parameters,
namely, our standard pitch system, I was somewhat hobbled by it. But then I
discovered electronic music a la Stockhausen, Xenakis, et al, different
temperaments, and all sorts of other sound worlds. I also grew up hearing
music from other cultures, so it wasn't so hard to erase most prejudices. I
find this ability now, to be an absolute blessing because it is not just a
talent for remembering pitches, it is a talent for remembering sounds
accurately. Being a blind musician, it compensates greatly for not being
able to look at all the scores I'd so much like to. At 10:34 PM 11/5/99
-0500, you wrote:
>From: johnlink@con2.com (John Link)
>
>>From: Jay Williams <jaywill@utah-inter.net>
>>..... When I'm singing in a casual
>>manner, either to myself or to someone "in passing", I sing a given song in
>>whatever key happens to feel kumfy at the moment and intonation be slightly
>>damned. I often hear myself singing in a key somewhere between two
>>"standard" pitches, but feel no compunction to change it.
>
>
>Jay,
>
>Your intonation need be damned only if the pitches you sing don't relate
>correctly to each other. As long as they relate correctly to each other you
>are in tune!
>
>John Link
>ALMOST ACAPPELLA
>
>>You do not need web access to participate. You may subscribe through
>email. Send an empty email to one of these addresses:
> tuning-subscribe@onelist.com - subscribe to the tuning list.
> tuning-unsubscribe@onelist.com - unsubscribe from the tuning list.
> tuning-digest@onelist.com - switch your subscription to digest mode.
> tuning-normal@onelist.com - switch your subscription to normal mode.
>
>
>

When I was in music school, some of the folks with perfect pitch had a very
difficult time with the transcription exercises (prof. plays a tune,
students transcrib after 1 or two hearings). Especcially if there was
harmony going on. The folks with perfect pitch would not listen to the
sonorities, but would instead identify individual pitches. The result was
they could not keep up.

Darren

> Frankly, I find the concept of perfect pitch ludicrous. I want to work
with
> musicians who listen to what is happening and can relate to that, not to
> their memory of some instrument that is not being played. So perfect pitch
> is a skill that I would not care to develop. If any singer auditioning for
> me claimed perfect pitch as one of his skills, I'd listen extra carefully
> to how he sang in an ensemble. Would he sing the so-called correct pitches
> if the rest of the ensemble drifted, or would he go with the ensemble?
When
> singing F in a Dmin7 chord and then in a G7 chord would he sing the same
> pitch both times, or would he adjust according to harmonic context? I want
> singers who do the latter in both cases, and I suspect that anyone
claiming
> perfect pitch might do the former.
>