Yahoo Tuning Groups Ultimate Backup tuning modulation in persian music

Hi dears

Radif of persian music is systemt of dastgahs.each dastgah as subsets of
radif has a few goosheh .

The structure of goosheh is based on different formulas which is
charactristic for each.

the strucrture of each dastgah is based on tetrachordal-structure of
intervals :

1- the tetrachordal structure A+B modulates to one perfect fifth up the
tonic of scale.

For example starting with SHUR C and going to SHUR G.

2-Interesting that the sequence of tetrachords in the structure of
dastgah is like A+B+C+.......instead of A+B+A+B.(C BECAUSE OF EFFECT OF
SHIFTING OF FIFTH)

So u see that some goosheh in a dastgah can represent new
tetrachordal-structure and ways to modulation to another dastgahs.

For example in segah dastgah you can go to homayoon or isfahan as
modulation . but the modulation occur after palying gooshehs in a
sequence . u can not start the dar-a-mad (starting goosheh of a dastgah)
and modulate befor ending .

3-U can also change your modal expression in a gooshe structure by
changing function of structral intervals in it. It makes another formula
for new goosheh or goosheh of yours not included in radif and new to
every body(new modal expression)

But as radif is playing for almost 1 century , the new musician think it
as only a way of improvising ..... and looking for new ways of
modulation to dastgahs which there is no modal way for them.

________________________________

From: Kraig Grady [mailto:kraiggrady@anaphoria.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2005 7:11 PM
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [tuning] ragas, maqams, (Bach . . )

13th Century Persian music theory is the source of north Indian tuning.
not Sure about the Maqams , but i read recently that the Radif has
prearranged formulas for modulation
with the improvisations being before and after.
Structurally and compositionally i find this idea quite appealing

>
>Message: 9
> Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2005 00:05:25 -0500 (EST)
> From: Christopher Bailey <chris@music.columbia.edu>
>Subject: ragas, maqams, (Bach . . )
>
>
>What you have described "smells" very much like the 'maqam'
>concept/structure in maqam music.
>

>Not all maqams modulate as far as I know.

>
>
>
>
>
>

--
Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>
The Wandering Medicine Show
KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los Angeles

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🔗Lorenzo Frizzera <lorenzo.frizzera@cdmrovereto.it>

Hi.

I did'nt know nothing about persian music.
After I've read this http://www.duke.edu/~azomorod/dastgah.html I've better understood what you mean.

I think that this system is very similar to ancient greek music. Am I wrong?

Lorenzo
----- Original Message -----
From: Mohajeri Shahin
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2005 5:25 AM
Subject: [tuning] modulation in persian music

Hi dears

Radif of persian music is systemt of dastgahs.each dastgah as subsets of radif has a few goosheh .

The structure of goosheh is based on different formulas which is charactristic for each.

the strucrture of each dastgah is based on tetrachordal-structure of intervals :

1- the tetrachordal structure A+B modulates to one perfect fifth up the tonic of scale.

For example starting with SHUR C and going to SHUR G.

2-Interesting that the sequence of tetrachords in the structure of dastgah is like A+B+C+...instead of A+B+A+B.(C BECAUSE OF EFFECT OF SHIFTING OF FIFTH)

So u see that some goosheh in a dastgah can represent new tetrachordal-structure and ways to modulation to another dastgahs.

For example in segah dastgah you can go to homayoon or isfahan as modulation . but the modulation occur after palying gooshehs in a sequence . u can not start the dar-a-mad (starting goosheh of a dastgah) and modulate befor ending .

3-U can also change your modal expression in a gooshe structure by changing function of structral intervals in it. It makes another formula for new goosheh or goosheh of yours not included in radif and new to every body(new modal expression)

But as radif is playing for almost 1 century , the new musician think it as only a way of improvising ... and looking for new ways of modulation to dastgahs which there is no modal way for them.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Kraig Grady [mailto:kraiggrady@anaphoria.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2005 7:11 PM
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [tuning] ragas, maqams, (Bach . . )

--
Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>
The Wandering Medicine Show
KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los Angeles

Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT

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🔗Mohajeri Shahin <shahinm@kayson-ir.com>

The theoric basis of persian music was affeted by theories of
pythagorean school in the era of al-farabi and avicena.but at the past
and before construction of dastgah system , our music had maqams like
turkish and arabic.

shaahin

________________________________

From: Lorenzo Frizzera [mailto:lorenzo.frizzera@cdmrovereto.it]
Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2005 5:11 PM
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [tuning] modulation in persian music

Hi.

I did'nt know nothing about persian music.

After I've read this http://www.duke.edu/~azomorod/dastgah.html I've
better understood what you mean.

I think that this system is very similar to ancient greek music. Am I
wrong?

Lorenzo

----- Original Message -----

From: Mohajeri Shahin <mailto:shahinm@kayson-ir.com>

To: tuning@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2005 5:25 AM

Subject: [tuning] modulation in persian music

Hi dears

Radif of persian music is systemt of dastgahs.each dastgah as
subsets of radif has a few goosheh .

The structure of goosheh is based on different formulas which is
charactristic for each.

the strucrture of each dastgah is based on
tetrachordal-structure of intervals :

1- the tetrachordal structure A+B modulates to one perfect fifth
up the tonic of scale.

For example starting with SHUR C and going to SHUR G.

2-Interesting that the sequence of tetrachords in the structure
of dastgah is like A+B+C+.......instead of A+B+A+B.(C BECAUSE OF EFFECT
OF SHIFTING OF FIFTH)

So u see that some goosheh in a dastgah can represent new
tetrachordal-structure and ways to modulation to another dastgahs.

For example in segah dastgah you can go to homayoon or isfahan
as modulation . but the modulation occur after palying gooshehs in a
sequence . u can not start the dar-a-mad (starting goosheh of a dastgah)
and modulate befor ending .

3-U can also change your modal expression in a gooshe structure
by changing function of structral intervals in it. It makes another
formula for new goosheh or goosheh of yours not included in radif and
new to every body(new modal expression)

But as radif is playing for almost 1 century , the new musician
think it as only a way of improvising ..... and looking for new ways of
modulation to dastgahs which there is no modal way for them.

________________________________

From: Kraig Grady [mailto:kraiggrady@anaphoria.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2005 7:11 PM
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [tuning] ragas, maqams, (Bach . . )

13th Century Persian music theory is the source of north Indian
tuning.
not Sure about the Maqams , but i read recently that the Radif
has
prearranged formulas for modulation
with the improvisations being before and after.
Structurally and compositionally i find this idea quite
appealing

>Not all maqams modulate as far as I know.

>
>
>
>
>
>

--
Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island
<http://anaphoria.com/>
The Wandering Medicine Show
KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los
Angeles

You can configure your subscription by sending an empty email to
one
of these addresses (from the address at which you receive the
list):
tuning-subscribe@yahoogroups.com - join the tuning group.
tuning-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com - leave the group.
tuning-nomail@yahoogroups.com - turn off mail from the group.
tuning-digest@yahoogroups.com - set group to send daily
digests.
tuning-normal@yahoogroups.com - set group to send individual
emails.
tuning-help@yahoogroups.com - receive general help
information.

________________________________

Yahoo! Groups Links

* To visit your group on the web, go to:
/tuning/

* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
tuning-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:tuning-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>

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🔗Ozan Yarman <ozanyarman@superonline.com>

Dear brother Mohajeri,

Our musical heritage links us to the same past. But tell me please about the destgah system and its difference from the maqam system. What are the fundamental differences after the Persian reform in music? And when did this conversion take place?

Peace,
Ozan
----- Original Message -----
From: Mohajeri Shahin
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 06 Ocak 2005 Perşembe 6:02
Subject: RE: [tuning] modulation in persian music

The theoric basis of persian music was affeted by theories of pythagorean school in the era of al-farabi and avicena.but at the past and before construction of dastgah system , our music had maqams like turkish and arabic.

shaahin

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Lorenzo Frizzera [mailto:lorenzo.frizzera@cdmrovereto.it]
Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2005 5:11 PM
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [tuning] modulation in persian music

Hi.

I did'nt know nothing about persian music.

After I've read this http://www.duke.edu/~azomorod/dastgah.html I've better understood what you mean.

I think that this system is very similar to ancient greek music. Am I wrong?

Lorenzo

----- Original Message -----

From: Mohajeri Shahin

To: tuning@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2005 5:25 AM

Subject: [tuning] modulation in persian music

Hi dears

Radif of persian music is systemt of dastgahs.each dastgah as subsets of radif has a few goosheh .

The structure of goosheh is based on different formulas which is charactristic for each.

the strucrture of each dastgah is based on tetrachordal-structure of intervals :

1- the tetrachordal structure A+B modulates to one perfect fifth up the tonic of scale.

For example starting with SHUR C and going to SHUR G.

2-Interesting that the sequence of tetrachords in the structure of dastgah is like A+B+C+…….instead of A+B+A+B.(C BECAUSE OF EFFECT OF SHIFTING OF FIFTH)

So u see that some goosheh in a dastgah can represent new tetrachordal-structure and ways to modulation to another dastgahs.

For example in segah dastgah you can go to homayoon or isfahan as modulation . but the modulation occur after palying gooshehs in a sequence . u can not start the dar-a-mad (starting goosheh of a dastgah) and modulate befor ending .

3-U can also change your modal expression in a gooshe structure by changing function of structral intervals in it. It makes another formula for new goosheh or goosheh of yours not included in radif and new to every body(new modal expression)

But as radif is playing for almost 1 century , the new musician think it as only a way of improvising ….. and looking for new ways of modulation to dastgahs which there is no modal way for them.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Kraig Grady [mailto:kraiggrady@anaphoria.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2005 7:11 PM
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [tuning] ragas, maqams, (Bach . . )

--
Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>
The Wandering Medicine Show
KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los Angeles

Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT

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a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
/tuning/

b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.