Kafi thaat

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Afmmjr@a... wrote:
>>>> Hi Lorenzo,
> I think this is mostly correct. However, the Bb (which is called
simply "B" in German) was probably first for musical reasons. The B
natural (which is called "H" in German) was probably the development.
In other words, the sound of the interval is earlier than the
spelling of its position in a theory. best, Johnny >>>>

Hello, In the olden days, the Sa was located where we have Bb today.
Thus, the standard scale in the past was not Bilawal (all natural
notes), but Kafi (the third and the seventh notes flat).

Regards,
Haresh.

Hello Haresh,

In the good old days, Rast was the principal pitch 1/1 of the scale system used by the Ottoman Empire & co. Nowadays, Chargah is accepted as C4 on the staff in Turkish Music (an abhorrent blunder in my sight). It is only a recent proposition of mine vindicating actual practice that the perde-system is not based on pitches but degrees. Thus, a perde-system starting with Rast can be transposed to any aheng (key). Maqam modulations then take place within the transposed system. Do you think there are any parallels between my approach and Indian Art Music practice?

Cordially,
Ozan
----- Original Message -----
From: Haresh BAKSHI
To: tuning@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 04 Ocak 2005 Salı 5:30
Subject: [tuning] Kafi thaat

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, Afmmjr@a... wrote:
>>>> Hi Lorenzo,
> I think this is mostly correct. However, the Bb (which is called
simply "B" in German) was probably first for musical reasons. The B
natural (which is called "H" in German) was probably the development.
In other words, the sound of the interval is earlier than the
spelling of its position in a theory. best, Johnny >>>>

Hello, In the olden days, the Sa was located where we have Bb today.
Thus, the standard scale in the past was not Bilawal (all natural
notes), but Kafi (the third and the seventh notes flat).

Regards,
Haresh.

You can configure your subscription by sending an empty email to one
of these addresses (from the address at which you receive the list):
tuning-subscribe@yahoogroups.com - join the tuning group.
tuning-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com - leave the group.
tuning-nomail@yahoogroups.com - turn off mail from the group.
tuning-digest@yahoogroups.com - set group to send daily digests.
tuning-normal@yahoogroups.com - set group to send individual emails.
tuning-help@yahoogroups.com - receive general help information.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
/tuning/

b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
tuning-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

Hello Ozan, thanks for your post.

>>>> In the good old days, Rast was the principal pitch 1/1 of the
scale system used by the Ottoman Empire & co. Nowadays, Chargah is
accepted as C4 on the staff in Turkish Music (an abhorrent blunder in
my sight). >>>>

Do you mean that C4 is now the key/Tonic for Chargah?

>>>> It is only a recent proposition of mine vindicating actual
practice that the perde-system is not based on pitches but degrees.
Thus, a perde-system starting with Rast can be transposed to any aheng
(key). Maqam modulations then take place within the transposed system.
Do you think there are any parallels between my approach and Indian
Art Music practice? >>>>

Let us refer to playing a raga on Sitar. Yes, we shift the fret
(singular perdah; plural perde) positions according to the flats
occurring in the raga. However, in case of the raga Bhairavi (C Db Eb
F G Ab Bb), I have seen it played with the key/tonic on the fret which
is usually the second natural note normally. We may call this a case
of "transposing for convenience".

>>>> Do you think there are any parallels between my approach and
Indian Art Music practice? >>>>

I know too little about your music to be able to answer that. I recall
that I had some off-list exchange of views with Dr. Akkoc in the past.
I do not recollect what it was right now.

However, there is no modulation in Indian music.

Regards,
Haresh.