Re: [tuning] Re: New Telemann page.2

In a message dated 11/13/01 4:36:49 PM Eastern Standard Time,
BobWendell@technet-inc.com writes:

> I still have the impression that Bach wrote the Well-Tempered Clavier
> to showcase the special properties of the Werckmeister temperament he
> favored. His two- and three-part inventions never venture into the
> remote keys that this work does. Instead the key signatures look
> suspiciously like they accomodate some kind of regular, open meantone
> temperament.
>
> Admittedly, he could have done this out of deference to tuning
> practice in the wider musical world around him, but I wonder why
> you're so adamant about the exclusivity of his commitment to
>

It was not so much to showcase, as to show their usability. Yes, all the
diatonic keys reflect a meantone. Only, Werckmeister chromatic mirrors sixth
comma meantone...which is, significantly, what his organ builder preferred
(Silbermann). And the argument is already being made for 1/6th comma
meantone for Telemann, Bach's friend. My thesis is that Werckmeister
chromatic already accounts for full usage for all of music, requiring only
the picking and choosing of instrument with circumstance and practicality of
execution.

Really, I have listened and performed in a myriad of tunings. I have no axe
to grind with this. In my Masters thesis (published in PITCH I:2) I wrote on
Bach's Tuning, preferring not to claim anything definitive, except the
POSSIBILITY that the composer might not be in equal temperament. Boy, was
that a fire cracker at Columbia University. Thanks to Professor Joel Newman,
it was accepted towards my not-to-be second Masters (in
ethnomusicology)...but that's another story.

I've made several visits to Bach's environs and continue to find out new
information, all leading to a continuous use of Werckmeister chromatic
throughout his life. Most important: there is nothing at all found to the
contrary!

Thanks for your interest, :)

Johnny Reinhard

--- In tuning@y..., Afmmjr@a... wrote:
> >
> Really, I have listened and performed in a myriad of tunings. I
have no axe
> to grind with this. In my Masters thesis (published in PITCH I:2)
I wrote on
> Bach's Tuning, preferring not to claim anything definitive, except
the
> POSSIBILITY that the composer might not be in equal temperament.
Boy, was
> that a fire cracker at Columbia University. Thanks to Professor
Joel Newman,
> it was accepted towards my not-to-be second Masters (in
> ethnomusicology)...but that's another story.

Bob:
Yes, it never ceases to amaze me how utterly unwilling academics can
be to consider possibilities that conflict with their intellectual
investments and therefore lie outside of the academic real estate
they've staked out for themselves in spite of the sometimes so
clearly untenable positions they are thus forced maintain.

>
> I've made several visits to Bach's environs and continue to find
out new
> information, all leading to a continuous use of Werckmeister
chromatic
> throughout his life. Most important: there is nothing at all found
to the
> contrary!
>
> Thanks for your interest, :)
>
> Johnny Reinhard

Bob:
Yes, this is interesting, and I certainly respect the research you've
done. I still refer to what I view as the practical reality of
fudging, conscious or not, or even plain old-fashioned intonational
fallibility that real, everyday musicians, including professionals of
high order, exhibit (I think to some degree inevitably), unless they
are scrupulously trained to respect with a high degree of
impeccability the particular tuning system in question. I don't see
this latter possibility as a very realistic assumption to make about
any period, no matter which composer is under consideration.

Further, Leopold Mozart's using enharmonics that theoretically
violate his own teaching methods simply means to me that practical
musicians recognize and exploit near identities as unison vectors
when it suits their purposes. We do that here, don't we? And why not?

And why should Bach be an exception if he ever wanted to be? And why
should playing the Unaccompanied Partitas and Sonatas for Violin in
adaptive JI, for example, be considered other than an authentic
interpretive possibility, since the neither the instrument nor the
music mandate Werckmeister? Or do you think the music does, because
it is either compatible with it, or because it seems to you
idiomatically adapted to that specific temperament in such obvious
and incontrovertible ways that it borders on criminality not to
adhere to Werckmeister?