arabic music is microtonal

[Paul stated:]

> Arabic music has lots of 3/4-tones . . . in order to play all
> the modes, you need to make 1/4-tone distinctions . . . I'd
> call that a microtonal tuning system.

I never said it wasn't.

To me, Arabic tunings are microtonal.

Not sure I'm ready to say that Arabic music uses steps
of precisely 150.000 cents. Do we have any objective
(ie cold hard facts of science) that verifies that? And
no I don't mean lits of cents values by
ethnomusicologists who were doing it by ear, but stuff
that's been measured accurately and precisely from
actual common practices of actual traditionally trained
musicians in the region.

- Jeff

--- In tuning@y..., "X. J. Scott" <xjscott@e...> wrote:
> [Paul stated:]
>
> > Arabic music has lots of 3/4-tones . . . in order to play all
> > the modes, you need to make 1/4-tone distinctions . . . I'd
> > call that a microtonal tuning system.
>
> I never said it wasn't.
>
> To me, Arabic tunings are microtonal.
>
> Not sure I'm ready to say that Arabic music uses steps
> of precisely 150.000 cents. Do we have any objective
> (ie cold hard facts of science) that verifies that? And
> no I don't mean lits of cents values by
> ethnomusicologists who were doing it by ear, but stuff
> that's been measured accurately and precisely from
> actual common practices of actual traditionally trained
> musicians in the region.
>
> - Jeff

Actual measurements show variations from region to region, from style
to style. But the 150-cent steps form a standard in most of
the "industrialized" centers of the Middle East, from Cairo to
Baghdad. Any Arabic music that is played with a string orchestra, or
is on an Arabic TV program, etc., you can be pretty sure uses steps
close to 150 cents. Note that Turkish and Persian styles are very
different from this.

On 5 Sep 01, at 15:20, "Paul Erlich" <paul@stretch-music.com> wrote:

> --- In tuning@y..., "X. J. Scott" <xjscott@e...> wrote:
> > [Paul stated:]
> >
> > > Arabic music has lots of 3/4-tones . . . in order to play all
> > > the modes, you need to make 1/4-tone distinctions . . . I'd
> > > call that a microtonal tuning system.
> >
> > I never said it wasn't.
> >
> > To me, Arabic tunings are microtonal.
> >
> > Not sure I'm ready to say that Arabic music uses steps
> > of precisely 150.000 cents. Do we have any objective
> > (ie cold hard facts of science) that verifies that? And
> > no I don't mean lits of cents values by
> > ethnomusicologists who were doing it by ear, but stuff
> > that's been measured accurately and precisely from
> > actual common practices of actual traditionally trained
> > musicians in the region.
> >
> > - Jeff
>
> Actual measurements show variations from region to region, from style to
> style. But the 150-cent steps form a standard in most of the
> "industrialized" centers of the Middle East, from Cairo to Baghdad. Any
> Arabic music that is played with a string orchestra, or is on an Arabic TV
> program, etc., you can be pretty sure uses steps close to 150 cents. Note
> that Turkish and Persian styles are very different from this.
>

Paul,

Is the difference in Turkish/Persian and Arab style really one of theory,
or of practice as well?

Regards,

Polychronios Moniodis

--- In tuning@y..., Polychroni <UPB_MONIODIS@O...> wrote:

> Paul,
>
> Is the difference in Turkish/Persian and Arab style really one of
theory,
> or of practice as well?

Both. Turkish, Persian, and Arabic styles are all different as
regards both theory and practice. There are some similarities, and
significant cross-cultural influences, of course, but the musics
remain distinct.