Re: Barbershop

Carl writes:

>If you take a bunch of short samples of a typcial Barbershop song,
you'll
>find a justly-tuned 7-limit chord most of the time.
>
>This may not sound very strong, so let me be clear: Barbershop is the
most
>consistent and deliberate higher-limit music I know of. It is not some

>accidental, sometimes JI, sometimes 7-limit music. It is an entire
style
>firmly commited to the 7-limit. Their theory is fully aware of the
tuning
>issue, their mission statement contains reference to JI, and even
amatur
>groups sing nicely in tune.

So the m7ths are 7/4 but
are the 3rds = 7/6 & 9/7 or are they 5/4 & 6/5s?

--
* D a v i d B e a r d s l e y
* xouoxno@virtulink.com
*
* J u x t a p o s i t i o n E z i n e
* M E L A v i r t u a l d r e a m house monitor
*
* http://www.virtulink.com/immp/lookhere.htm

Yes carl please elaborate
I have spent the last two years w/the seven limit
Do you tune the base frequency to the hum of the electric razor at 448? What
speed would that shaver be on?
Love
P

David Beardsley wrote:

> From: David Beardsley <xouoxno@virtulink.com>
>
> Carl writes:
>
> >If you take a bunch of short samples of a typcial Barbershop song,
> you'll
> >find a justly-tuned 7-limit chord most of the time.
> >
> >This may not sound very strong, so let me be clear: Barbershop is the
> most
> >consistent and deliberate higher-limit music I know of. It is not some
>
> >accidental, sometimes JI, sometimes 7-limit music. It is an entire
> style
> >firmly commited to the 7-limit. Their theory is fully aware of the
> tuning
> >issue, their mission statement contains reference to JI, and even
> amatur
> >groups sing nicely in tune.
>
> So the m7ths are 7/4 but
> are the 3rds = 7/6 & 9/7 or are they 5/4 & 6/5s?
>
> --
> * D a v i d B e a r d s l e y
> * xouoxno@virtulink.com
> *
> * J u x t a p o s i t i o n E z i n e
> * M E L A v i r t u a l d r e a m house monitor
> *
> * http://www.virtulink.com/immp/lookhere.htm
>
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[David Beardsley]
>It is an entire style firmly commited to the 7-limit. Their theory is
fully >aware of the tuning issue, their mission statement contains
reference to JI, >and even amatur groups sing nicely in tune.
>
>So the m7ths are 7/4 but are the 3rds = 7/6 & 9/7 or are they 5/4 & 6/5s?

Barbershop is tetradic music, and where triads are involved they would
normally be ones made with 5/4 and 6/5, 7/6 and 9/7 popping up maybe
occasionally due to voice leading.

[Dan Stearns]
>My (limited) understanding (or more likely lack thereof...) was that it was
>some sort of a (very interesting) conglomeration were the main tune (the
>melody) was (more or less) - as it were on the piano, and the "chords" were
>locked in (JI beatless) to that... ?

That's the idea. In practice, of course, all kinds of things can happen.
I do think that Boomslitter and Creel comes closer than any idea I know of
to a theory of melody, but their work was very limited and incomplete. I
think the Pythagorean diatonic comes closest to describing Barbershop
melodies, with inflections of two types: (1) from the 12-tone Pythagorean
cycle (2) with the usual tendency of singers to tune passing tones from a
harmonic series between two strong tones.

[Charlie Jordan]
>>Being four-part, it is flexible to write for and a joy to listen to (as a
>>composer, I find 4-part writing perhaps my favorite).
>
>Have there been compositions for Barbershop quintet, or do the Beach Boys
>hold a patent on 5-part vocal harmony?

No, Barbershop is strictly a four-part style. Beach boys were amateurs,
but there's lots of good 5-part doowap.

Carl

At 11:10 AM 1/10/99 -0500, Carl Lumma wrote:
>From: Carl Lumma <clumma@nni.com>
>
>[David Beardsley]
>>It is an entire style firmly commited to the 7-limit. Their theory is
>fully >aware of the tuning issue, their mission statement contains
>reference to JI, >and even amatur groups sing nicely in tune.
>>
>>So the m7ths are 7/4 but are the 3rds = 7/6 & 9/7 or are they 5/4 & 6/5s?
>
>Barbershop is tetradic music, and where triads are involved they would
>normally be ones made with 5/4 and 6/5, 7/6 and 9/7 popping up maybe
>occasionally due to voice leading.

There is a 7/6 interval near the top. To put that interval over the bass
line would create a 6:7:?:? chord rather than the 4:5:6:7 shown. The
6:7:8:10 inversion is the least popular.

Perhaps a separate analysis of each voice would be enlightening. Overtones
and difference tones might be less prominent.

--Charlie Jordan <http://www.rev.net/~aloe/music>

Carl wrote,

>I can't argue with that! Seriously, what does the invention of 12-tET have
>to do with what Barbershopers sing?

12-tET is everywhere.

>I'm not familiar with Forte, or with a good definition of "functional
>harmony". But I know what a dominant chord is. Barbershop music contains
>plenty of them, often tuned 4:5:6:7. It also contains tetrads which are
>not dominant chords, and are tuned 4:5:6:7, and in fact this latter type of
>chord is at least as plentiful as the former type in the typical Barbershop
>performance.

Really? They're not secondary dominants or deceptive dominants? Can you give
an example?

>The answer is no, but I take that as far less of an indicator than what's
>been going on during the rest of the tune.

Well then please clarify.