Re: overtones, undertones and equaltones

Hi John,

The thought was that one might somehow adaptively tune the chords to match the inharmonic
partials of a bell sound.

I.e, try and make the chords closer to bell sounds, in the same way that you make them
closer to j.i. intervals in adaptive retuning.

Since most of this piece consists of bell sounds, and some of the melodic motifs kind of
link to that too, seems might be a possibility.

I suppose one would look over the bell partials recorded at:
http://www.oakcroft13.fsnet.co.uk/index.htm
and find ones that most closely resembled Debussy's chords.

Or perhaps one could use a database of several and let your program find the best fit - if
it can work that way.

Many of them have doublets of some of the notes, like the 1909.27 and 1910.25 in:

1/1 1201.74 cents 1491.76 cents 1909.27 cents 1910.25 cents 2400.46 cents 2895.49 cents
2896.94 cents 3106.33 cents 3109.37 cents 3671.72 cents

Though others don't, and one gets the impression that it can actually be a desired feature
of
a bell to be without doublets.

I thought that was what you meant by doubling the notes, but maybe you had something else
in mind.

BTW I've really enjoyed your adaptive tunings of the Mozart piece. Really a lot of fun. I
thought the
7-limit version was great and somehow sounded surprisingly authentic to me, perhaps
because
it so well fitted Mozart's sense of fun in this piece. I think he'd have enjoyed it
somehow!

I loved the arpeggiated chords in the 7 limit version.

Also the slower tender passages were beautiful.

Robert

[Robert Walker wrote:]
>Hi John,

>The thought was that one might somehow adaptively tune the chords to
>match the inharmonic partials of a bell sound.

>I.e, try and make the chords closer to bell sounds, in the same way
>that you make them closer to j.i. intervals in adaptive retuning.

>Since most of this piece consists of bell sounds, and some of the
>melodic motifs kind of link to that too, seems might be a possibility.

Ah! It suddenly clicks. Now I feel a bit dense, not having understood
before what you meant. Such a thing might be accomplished using my
existing software with one or more new tuning files. It'd be a fair
amount of work, though, so I might not be able to try right away...

>I thought that was what you meant by doubling the notes, but maybe you
>had something else in mind.

I had in mind that you wanted each note replicated many times, but now
I see that I was misunderstanding.

>BTW I've really enjoyed your adaptive tunings of the Mozart piece.
>Really a lot of fun.

Kyool! I've been listening to that piece a lot myself lately. In fact,
it's singing in my head as I write this. Having music "play" in my
mind while I'm doing something else seems to be about the only true
multi-tasking that my brain is capable of - it has a life, a flow, of
its own that does not detract from other thought processes, as far as I
can tell. I still occasionally get something that I hate "stuck" but
fortunately that seems to happen less and less as I get more, uh,
mature (substitute your own adjective as desired).

>I thought the 7-limit version was great and somehow sounded
>surprisingly authentic to me, perhaps because it so well fitted
>Mozart's sense of fun in this piece. I think he'd have enjoyed it
>somehow!

It sure would be nice if we could somehow ask him, wouldn't it? But,
even if someone came forward with a tirade by Mozart against 7-limit
music (which, as far as I know, he never had the opportunity to hear),
I'd still love the 7-limit treatments of his works - my ear is just
"there".

>I loved the arpeggiated chords in the 7 limit version.

>Also the slower tender passages were beautiful.

Oh yeah! I'm right there with you... 7-limit has a beauty that nothing
else can match, IMHO. Clearly, it's not for everybody, at least not
*yet*. ;->

Thanks for your comments!

JdL

Hi John,

> Ah! It suddenly clicks. Now I feel a bit dense, not having understood
> before what you meant. Such a thing might be accomplished using my
> >existing software with one or more new tuning files. It'd be a fair
> amount of work, though, so I might not be able to try right away...
...
> I had in mind that you wanted each note replicated many times, but now
> I see that I was misunderstanding.

Yes, I understand now what you meant too. The mention of doubling
notes confused me as I immediately thought of bell timbre doublets.

I'll be very interested to hear what it sounds like. Certainly "experimental"
- wonder what it will sound like targetting bell partials!

I suppose one could also try targetting gamelan pitches for some
Debussy as well,....

If you are interested to try it out, I'll be fascinated to hear how it
works out.

> Kyool! I've been listening to that piece a lot myself lately. In fact,
> it's singing in my head as I write this. Having music "play" in my
> mind while I'm doing something else seems to be about the only true
> multi-tasking that my brain is capable of - it has a life, a flow, of
> its own that does not detract from other thought processes, as far as I
> can tell. I still occasionally get something that I hate "stuck" but
> fortunately that seems to happen less and less as I get more, uh,
mature (substitute your own adjective as desired).

Yes. this is a piece one certainly will be glad to hear "play" in ones mind.
Really uplifts ones spirits!

> It sure would be nice if we could somehow ask him, wouldn't it? But,
> even if someone came forward with a tirade by Mozart against 7-limit
> music (which, as far as I know, he never had the opportunity to hear),
> I'd still love the 7-limit treatments of his works - my ear is just
> "there".

>I loved the arpeggiated chords in the 7 limit version.

>Also the slower tender passages were beautiful.

> Oh yeah! I'm right there with you... 7-limit has a beauty that nothing
> else can match, IMHO. Clearly, it's not for everybody, at least not
> *yet*. ;->

Yes, it is very gentle and kind of soft and wistful in the slower passages in this piece.

Beautiful!

Robert