Re : [tuning] Canto Sacro (was: CSOUND)

Maurizio Umberto Puxeddy:

> In january 1999 I wrote "Canto sacro" a free chromatic counterpoint
> using 24TET. I'd like to play it somewhere in future with vo, va and db
> but at the moment the only version you could ear is a csound version. In
> fact this is not a plain rendering of the acoustic score but is a simple
> elaboration in the fields of timbre and reverberation.
>
> I was and am a very naive microtonalist but I still love to ear it.

Hi Maurizio,

Using 24tet, you won't find much 'fans' on this list, because it's far away
from Just Intonation and it has got 12tet as a subset...

However, many serious modern composers use it whenever they want to get out
of 12tet. I do play 24tet fretted guitar and perform compositions by
Carrillo, Haba, Luque, Visser, Criton. I would be interested to see your
score.

Wim Hoogewerf

Wim Hoogewerf wrote:
>
> Maurizio Umberto Puxeddy:
>
> > In january 1999 I wrote "Canto sacro" a free chromatic counterpoint
> > using 24TET. I'd like to play it somewhere in future with vo, va and db
> > but at the moment the only version you could ear is a csound version. In
> > fact this is not a plain rendering of the acoustic score but is a simple
> > elaboration in the fields of timbre and reverberation.
> >
> > I was and am a very naive microtonalist but I still love to ear it.
>
> Hi Maurizio,
>
> Using 24tet, you won't find much 'fans' on this list, because it's far away
> from Just Intonation and it has got 12tet as a subset...

I can understand that being a superset of 12tet can be a minus if you
want to be sure you can't do something similar to 12tet music "by
mistake".
It can be a plus if you want to migrate step by step away from 12tet
music, for example for pedagogical purposes.
If it is not a FAQ, why do most of people here prefer JI?

> However, many serious modern composers use it whenever they want to get out
> of 12tet. I do play 24tet fretted guitar and perform compositions by
> Carrillo, Haba, Luque, Visser, Criton. I would be interested to see your
> score.

I will scan the score and email it to you privately in some compressed
format.

Regards,

Maurizio Umberto Puxeddu

--- In tuning@egroups.com, Maurizio Umberto Puxeddu wrote:

http://www.egroups.com/message/tuning/17341

> Wim Hoogewerf wrote:
>
> > Using 24tet, you won't find much 'fans' on this list,
> > because it's far away from Just Intonation and it has got
> > 12tet as a subset...
>
> I can understand that being a superset of 12tet can be a minus
> if you want to be sure you can't do something similar to 12tet
> music "by mistake".

I was going to respond to Wim's post, but I'm glad I waited.

On the contrary in my case, Maurizio, one of the reasons why
I *like* composing in 24-tET is because I'm able to play off
the familiarity of 12-tET against the weirdness of the in-between
quarter-tones.

As an example, in my little ditty _24-eq Tune_:

http://www.ixpres.com/interval/monzo/24-eq/24-eq.htm

I use quartertones at various places in all of the first 4 measures
of the tune, then only the 12-tET subset in the 5th measure. To
my ears, this provides a sort of "resolution" effect.

-monz
http://www.ixpres.com/interval/monzo/homepage.html
'All roads lead to n^0'

I ( Wim Hoogewerf):
>>
>> Using 24tet, you won't find much 'fans' on this list, because it's far away
>> from Just Intonation and it has got 12tet as a subset...

Maurizio Umberto Puxeddu:

> I can understand that being a superset of 12tet can be a minus if you
> want to be sure you can't do something similar to 12tet music "by
> mistake".
> It can be a plus if you want to migrate step by step away from 12tet
> music, for example for pedagogical purposes.
> If it is not a FAQ, why do most of people here prefer JI?

Of course my remark was slightly provocative. I didn't mean at all to 'warn'
you to participate on the Tuning List. But each time 24tet turns up, I think
about my own situation: 24tet performing was my first experience in
microtonality. While working on some pieces, like Haba's Suite for guitar, I
gradually got familiar with the sound. Later, when I read Helmholtz and
Partch's Genesis, I was disappointed to see how little enthusiasm these
authors showed towards 24tet. Mostly, as I understood, for it's "roughness":
most intervals are far out of tune since they don't approximate simple
ratios. Fortunately, Margo Schulter wrote:

> Personally I find 24-tET a fascinating system because it combines
> near-just fifths and slightly subdued major thirds (400 cents, or
> about 8 cents narrower than the usual Pythagorean 81:64) with very
> close approximations of 13:10 (450 cents or 9/24 octave) and 15:13
> (250 cents or 5/24 octave), and also 26:15 (950 cents or 19/24
> octave). The 950-cent interval, for example, can serve as either a
> wide major sixth or a narrow minor seventh.
>
> Also, from a "JI-oriented" point of view, 24-tET has fine
> approximations of 11:9 (350 cents, 7/24 octave) and 11:8 (550 cents,
> 11/24 octave).

I observed, just as Margo does, that the 950 cents in 24tet falls right in
between 12/7 (933 cents) and 7/4 (969 cents). This knowledge helps me as a
performer. I can slightly push up or down these notes and thus help the ear
a little. This is for me a real valuable link with JI.

Wim Hoogewerf