Re: primes

I wrote:

> I'd realy like
> >to hear the whole thing. How long is this piece?

Dante wrote:

> There are two more sections, its probably 5 minutes all together. I might
> try generating the whole thing and seeing how big the file is, I don't want
> to clog up my disk space at my server cause I plan to put up a bunch of
> soundfiles of my new JI guitar and my harmonic sitar, etc.

Is the harmonic sitar a real instrument or is it a virtual instrument
(CSound)?

>If you or anyone
> else uses Csound and is interested, I could send you the orc and sco files
> and you can generate it yourself and hear the better sound quality.

I don't use CSound, athough I should. Maybe I can arrange to
host it somewhere on my site in the future. I'd like to wait until
Virtulink upgrades their server. They have the new machine,
they just aren't happy with how it runs (whatever that means!).

--
* D a v i d B e a r d s l e y
* xouoxno@virtulink.com
*
* J u x t a p o s i t i o n E z i n e
* M E L A v i r t u a l d r e a m house monitor
*
* http://www.virtulink.com/immp/lookhere.htm

>From: David Beardsley <xouoxno@virtulink.com>
>
>Is the harmonic sitar a real instrument or is it a virtual instrument
>(CSound)?
>

Its a 3D instrument. I took the frets off a sitar and put a scale under the
strings with the positions of the first 16 harmonics marked for easy
playing. The strings are tuned 1/1 5/4 3/2 7/4 2/1, or 4:5:6:7:8

>I don't use CSound, athough I should. Maybe I can arrange to
>host it somewhere on my site in the future. I'd like to wait until
>Virtulink upgrades their server. They have the new machine,
>they just aren't happy with how it runs (whatever that means!).

You can get the program and manual from:

http://www.leeds.ac.uk/music/Man/c_front.html

dante

i tried to download th free Csound from the montreal sit and when i tried to do
the exe it said it was missing the proper .dll file
anyone know of a valid shareware??
Pat

David Beardsley wrote:

> From: David Beardsley <xouoxno@virtulink.com>
>
> I wrote:
>
> > I'd realy like
> > >to hear the whole thing. How long is this piece?
>
> Dante wrote:
>
> > There are two more sections, its probably 5 minutes all together. I might
> > try generating the whole thing and seeing how big the file is, I don't want
> > to clog up my disk space at my server cause I plan to put up a bunch of
> > soundfiles of my new JI guitar and my harmonic sitar, etc.
>
> Is the harmonic sitar a real instrument or is it a virtual instrument
> (CSound)?
>
> >If you or anyone
> > else uses Csound and is interested, I could send you the orc and sco files
> > and you can generate it yourself and hear the better sound quality.
>
> I don't use CSound, athough I should. Maybe I can arrange to
> host it somewhere on my site in the future. I'd like to wait until
> Virtulink upgrades their server. They have the new machine,
> they just aren't happy with how it runs (whatever that means!).
>
> --
> * D a v i d B e a r d s l e y
> * xouoxno@virtulink.com
> *
> * J u x t a p o s i t i o n E z i n e
> * M E L A v i r t u a l d r e a m house monitor
> *
> * http://www.virtulink.com/immp/lookhere.htm
>
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dante
that is the other one i tried to download from the Csound front page
maybe it's just my computer
Pat

Rosati wrote:

> From: "Rosati" <dante@pop.interport.net>
>
> >From: David Beardsley <xouoxno@virtulink.com>
> >
> >Is the harmonic sitar a real instrument or is it a virtual instrument
> >(CSound)?
> >
>
> Its a 3D instrument. I took the frets off a sitar and put a scale under the
> strings with the positions of the first 16 harmonics marked for easy
> playing. The strings are tuned 1/1 5/4 3/2 7/4 2/1, or 4:5:6:7:8
>
> >I don't use CSound, athough I should. Maybe I can arrange to
> >host it somewhere on my site in the future. I'd like to wait until
> >Virtulink upgrades their server. They have the new machine,
> >they just aren't happy with how it runs (whatever that means!).
>
> You can get the program and manual from:
>
> http://www.leeds.ac.uk/music/Man/c_front.html
>
> dante
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Message written at 14 Mar 1999 17:31:49 +0000

>>>>> "Rosati" == Rosati <dante@pop.interport.net> writes:

Rosati> You can get the program and manual from:

Rosati> http://www.leeds.ac.uk/music/Man/c_front.html

Please do not use that site. They have not updates it in YEARS, have
names wrong (mine for example) and have errors; we have asked then to
remove it. There is a new Csound front-page on MIT Press
http://mitpress.mit.edu/e-books/csound/frontpage.html
associated with the forthcoming book, but with much more that that.
Alternatively you can ftp stuff from ftp.maths.bath.ac.uk:pub/dream/
or the mirror site in University of Montreal.

For the kind of music I write, Csoudn is the only way I have of
hearing it.

==John ffitch

>
> Rosati> You can get the program and manual from:
>
> Rosati> http://www.leeds.ac.uk/music/Man/c_front.html
>
>Please do not use that site. They have not updates it in YEARS, have
>names wrong (mine for example) and have errors; we have asked then to
>remove it. There is a new Csound front-page on MIT Press
> http://mitpress.mit.edu/e-books/csound/frontpage.html
>associated with the forthcoming book, but with much more that that.
>Alternatively you can ftp stuff from ftp.maths.bath.ac.uk:pub/dream/
>or the mirror site in University of Montreal.

Well,... the site may be old, but the link to get Csound >is< to the bath
site. the Windows version I got there is 3.52, dated Feb 1999, the same
version thats available on the mit site. Anyway...thanks for the link, I was
wondering about the book and if it came out yet.

dante

Just noticed a little curiosity - for the 5 consecutive primes 5-7-11-13-17, every consecutive 3 totals a prime (5+7+11=23, 7+11+13=31, 11+13+17=41), and all 5 total a prime (53). Not particularly musically useful, though, until I get a string bass (I can only get up to 31 on cello) :)
Anyone else have any prime curiosities?
Chris

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On Tue, 20 Dec 2005, Christopher John Smith wrote:
>
> Just noticed a little curiosity - for the 5 consecutive
> primes 5-7-11-13-17, every consecutive 3 totals a
> prime (5+7+11=23, 7+11+13=31, 11+13+17=41), and all
> 5 total a prime (53). Not particularly musically useful,
> though, until I get a string bass (I can only get up to
> 31 on cello) :)
>
> Anyone else have any prime curiosities?

Hi Chris,

Thing about prime numbers is, you can go on
multiplying interesting coincidences about as
far as you're prepared to follow the sequence.

For example, I just did some quick sums on a
spreadsheet, and came up with these further
strings of consecutive prime triples with prime
sums (E&OE!):

17, 19, 23, 29, 31, 37, 41
(which add in triples to 59, 71, 83, 97, 109)

and:

41, 43, 47, 53, 59, 61, 67, 71, 73, 79,
83, 89, 97, 101, 103, 107, 109, 113, 127 (and
possibly further)

(which add in triples to:
131, 143, 159, 173, 187, 199, 211, 223, 235,
251, 269, 287, 301, 311, 319, 329, 349)

The only breaks between these three series
are given by triple sums which are squares!

13+17+19=49
37+41+43=121

Like you, I don't see any immediate musical
significance to these prime curiosities;
however, people have built careers on less.
For me, the test of the musical relevance of
these facts is: do people use them to make
good music - where I admit that "good" is
only my personal and not entirely objective
assessment.

Regards,
Yahya

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Hi Chris and Yahya.

You may have heard of the story about a Russian mathematician in company of
other people who he told to do these tasks (one task for each person):

A) Write down a three-digit number
B) Write this number once again right after itself, which results in a
six-digit number of three and three numerals to be identical.
C) Divide the six-digit number by 7.
D) Divide the result by 11.
E) Divide the new result by 13.

When the last result was compared with the three-digit number written at the
very beginning, everyone was surprised finding them actually identical. They
thought the mathematician was doing magic at first. After a while, he
explained that 7 * 11 * 13 = 1001, which you may actually imagine as
"001001" if you wish. Because of this, if you take any three-digit number
and repeat it right after itself, in fact, you multiply it by 7 * 11 * 13.

Petr

On Thu, 22 Dec 2005, Petr Pa��zek wrote:
>
> Hi Chris and Yahya.
>
> You may have heard of the story about a Russian mathematician in company
of
> other people who he told to do these tasks (one task for each person):
>
> A) Write down a three-digit number
> B) Write this number once again right after itself, which results in a
> six-digit number of three and three numerals to be identical.
> C) Divide the six-digit number by 7.
> D) Divide the result by 11.
> E) Divide the new result by 13.
>
> When the last result was compared with the three-digit number written at
the
> very beginning, everyone was surprised finding them actually identical.
They
> thought the mathematician was doing magic at first. After a while, he
> explained that 7 * 11 * 13 = 1001, which you may actually imagine as
> "001001" if you wish. Because of this, if you take any three-digit number
> and repeat it right after itself, in fact, you multiply it by 7 * 11 * 13.

Hi Petr!

Thanks for this! I _had_ been wondering how
I would spend the time at my sister-in-law's
party on Boxing Day (26th December). Now
I know how to keep some people busy talking
about something except cars and footy. Do
you think I should wait until they've had a
few beers? :-)

Best wishes of the season,
Yahya

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Hi Yahya.
You wrote:

> Thanks for this! I _had_ been wondering how
> I would spend the time at my sister-in-law's
> party on Boxing Day (26th December). Now
> I know how to keep some people busy talking
> about something except cars and footy. Do
> you think I should wait until they've had a
> few beers? :-)

I want to leave this decision upon yourself. It's you, of course, who knows
them. Some people get extremely passionate about everything after having a
few beers, for others it's just the opposite.
I'll tell you one more "sweet secret" (a very public secret, I see :-D ). If
you like, try out also this game:

A) Tell your companions to think of a number
B) Ask them to do its square
C) Then, they should begin subtracting ascending consecutive odd numbers
starting with 1, go on doing this untill they get a result of 0, and then
tell you the last odd number they subtracted.
D) Now, you add 1 to the number they've told you, divide this by 2, and
you get the number they were thinking of at the begining, which you can tell
them pretty quickly. Be sure they'll be amazed about the speed at which you
got their number.

The "magicians key" there is a special property discovered by Fibonnacci (in
the 15th century, I believe) that adding consecutive odd numbers makes
consecutive squares: 1 = 1*1, + 3 = 2*2, + 5 = 3*3, + 7 = 4*4, + 9 = 5*5,
etc.
OK, happy Christmas too. Please let me know how you succeeded then.
Petr

Petr,

I like your tricks!

As for when Fibonacci published his self-accumulating
series, I read that it was in 1202 A.D.

-- Mark Rankin

--- Petr Par�zek <p.parizek@chello.cz> wrote:

> Hi Yahya.
> You wrote:
>
> > Thanks for this! I _had_ been wondering how
> > I would spend the time at my sister-in-law's
> > party on Boxing Day (26th December). Now
> > I know how to keep some people busy talking
> > about something except cars and footy. Do
> > you think I should wait until they've had a
> > few beers? :-)
>
> I want to leave this decision upon yourself. It's
> you, of course, who knows
> them. Some people get extremely passionate about
> everything after having a
> few beers, for others it's just the opposite.
> I'll tell you one more "sweet secret" (a very public
> secret, I see :-D ). If
> you like, try out also this game:
>
> A) Tell your companions to think of a number
> B) Ask them to do its square
> C) Then, they should begin subtracting ascending
> consecutive odd numbers
> starting with 1, go on doing this untill they get a
> result of 0, and then
> tell you the last odd number they subtracted.
> D) Now, you add 1 to the number they've told
> you, divide this by 2, and
> you get the number they were thinking of at the
> begining, which you can tell
> them pretty quickly. Be sure they'll be amazed about
> the speed at which you
> got their number.
>
> The "magicians key" there is a special property
> discovered by Fibonnacci (in
> the 15th century, I believe) that adding consecutive
> odd numbers makes
> consecutive squares: 1 = 1*1, + 3 = 2*2, + 5 = 3*3,
> + 7 = 4*4, + 9 = 5*5,
> etc.
> OK, happy Christmas too. Please let me know how you
> succeeded then.
> Petr
>
>

__________________________________
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Hi Mark.
You wrote:

> As for when Fibonacci published his self-accumulating
> series, I read that it was in 1202 A.D.

Was it??? OK, this is the first time I got it wrong so heavily. I see I'm
making mess in the story of maths. Thanks for this. Hope it won't be very
soon I'll do something like this next time.

Petr

Petr Parízek wrote:
> Hi Mark.
> You wrote:
>
>
>>As for when Fibonacci published his self-accumulating
>>series, I read that it was in 1202 A.D.
>
>
> Was it??? OK, this is the first time I got it wrong so heavily. I see I'm
> making mess in the story of maths. Thanks for this. Hope it won't be very
> soon I'll do something like this next time.
>
> Petr

Careful! I think you were not talking about Fibonacci numbers (1+1=2,
1+2=3, 2+3=5, 3+5=8, 13, 21, ...) but about square numbers (1+3=4,
4+5=9, 9+7=16, ...). While it is reasonable to suppose that Fibonacci
desribed the sequence of square numbers like this in book on
mathematics from 1202, I am positive that the Greeks knew about this
sequence and "polygonal numbers" in general, and it is unlikely that
this knowledge had been forgotten for a while.

klaus

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, klaus schmirler <KSchmir@o...> wrote:

> While it is reasonable to suppose that Fibonacci
> desribed the sequence of square numbers like this in book on
> mathematics from 1202, I am positive that the Greeks knew about this
> sequence and "polygonal numbers" in general, and it is unlikely that
> this knowledge had been forgotten for a while.

You'll actually find a table of figurate numbers in Nichomachus's
Introduction to Arithmetic, which as one of the Great Books is sitting
around unread in many people's libraries.

Gene Ward Smith wrote:

> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, klaus schmirler <KSchmir@o...> wrote:
> > >>While it is reasonable to suppose that Fibonacci >>desribed the sequence of square numbers like this in book on >>mathematics from 1202, I am positive that the Greeks knew about this >>sequence and "polygonal numbers" in general, and it is unlikely that >>this knowledge had been forgotten for a while.
> > > You'll actually find a table of figurate numbers in Nichomachus's
> Introduction to Arithmetic, which as one of the Great Books is sitting
> around unread in many people's libraries.

Not in my library. However, I have just seen on the mathworld site that the "other kind of square numbers" which I had discovered (no mathematician I knew then had ever heard of squares of the form 4*[whatever the triangular numbers are]+1) are already known as "centered square numbers". In my opinion, this is fun stuff for primary school (the two kinds of squares, not the formulas), yet nobody seems to know about it.

klaus

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, klaus schmirler <KSchmir@o...> wrote:

> Not in my library. However, I have just seen on the mathworld site
> that the "other kind of square numbers" which I had discovered (no
> mathematician I knew then had ever heard of squares of the form
> 4*[whatever the triangular numbers are]+1) are already known as
> "centered square numbers". In my opinion, this is fun stuff for
> primary school (the two kinds of squares, not the formulas), yet
> nobody seems to know about it.

The centered hexagonal numbers have a musical interpretation; they are
the number of notes in the nth 5-limit "crystal ball" scale:

http://66.98.148.43/~xenharmo/crystal.htm

http://mathworld.wolfram.com/HexNumber.html