Question about East Indian Classical Music

Good Morning to all!

I would like to ask a question about East Indian Classical Music.

I remember reading somewhere long ago about the time period in which
drone instruments (such as the Tamboura) were introduced into the
musical practice of East Indian Classical Music. I have since been
unable to find the reference materials where I read this. I'm
wondering if some learned person on the list could possibly help to
guide me to a paper or web site that may help me to read up on this
again. Also of interest, would be information about the use of drone
instruments in any cultures that use microtonal tunings - especially
where an instrument's sole purpose is to provide a drone for which
other instruments can play or improvise over. Any help would greatly
appreciated.

Thanks kindly,

Jacky Ligon

>Good Morning to all!
>
>I would like to ask a question about East Indian Classical Music.
>
>I remember reading somewhere long ago about the time period in which
>drone instruments (such as the Tamboura) were introduced into the
>musical practice of East Indian Classical Music. I have since been
>unable to find the reference materials where I read this.

I think it was Daniel Wolf who posted some historical information about
this. You could probably find it in the archives. Unfortunately, he is no
longer a subscriber to the list. His email is djwolf@snafu.de.

A historical study of Indian music by Prajnanananda has some information
about this, but it is of frankly uneven reliability and is more based on
oral tradition.

Bill

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^ Bill Alves email: alves@hmc.edu ^
^ Harvey Mudd College URL: http://www2.hmc.edu/~alves/ ^
^ 301 E. Twelfth St. (909)607-4170 (office) ^
^ Claremont CA 91711 USA (909)607-7600 (fax) ^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Bill,

Thanks kindly for this - I will check out the archives this evening
for his posts on the topic. It is most unfortunate that we've lost
Daniel.

Have a great day!

Jacky

P.S. I really love your web site - I visit frequently.

>
> I think it was Daniel Wolf who posted some historical information
about
> this. You could probably find it in the archives. Unfortunately, he
is no
> longer a subscriber to the list. His email is djwolf@s...
>
> A historical study of Indian music by Prajnanananda has some
information
> about this, but it is of frankly uneven reliability and is more
based on
> oral tradition.
>
> Bill

> I remember reading somewhere long ago about the time period in which
> drone instruments (such as the Tamboura) were introduced into the
> musical practice of East Indian Classical Music.

Bonnie Wade in "Music in India" does discuss this question. I seem to remember, but I may be wrong, that it was the 1600s or 1700s. (I.e., it is not an ancient practice; it is relatively recent.)

Rick

Rick,

Thanks for this information!! I did remember that it wasn't that
ancient of a practice, but was less sure of the dates of introduction
of this into widespread practice. I would like to also track down
this book as well.

There was something that I failed to mention in my eariler post that
I think is kind of interesting. The last two Indian music concerts
that I have attended were "Shashank", the Bansuri master, and Dr. K.
Raghavendra, a Vina master. At both of these concerts they were using
these little electronic Tamboura boxes to supply the drones. These
boxes were about the size of a small jam-box, and sounded to me like
they had Tamboura samples in them - they were very realistic sounding
too. I was unable to inspect one up close, but I would like to ask if
anyone on the list has ever got to see one of these to where you
might be able to tell me if the intervals of the drones could be
switched to other pitches? I sort of have mixed feelings about the
use of these in Classical Music - because there is nothing like the
real thing, but I must admit that it did serve the drone function
fairly well. Has anyone ever seen one of these up close? It appears
that the Indians are very close to some of the Electro/Acoustically
integrated Classical Music that we have in the West.

Thanks,

Jacky Ligon

--- In tuning@egroups.com, Rick McGowan <rmcgowan@a...> wrote:

> Bonnie Wade in "Music in India" does discuss this question. I seem
to remember, but I may be wrong, that it was the 1600s or 1700s.
(I.e., it is not an ancient practice; it is relatively recent.)
>
> Rick

>At both of these concerts they were using
>these little electronic Tamboura boxes to supply the drones. These
>boxes were about the size of a small jam-box, and sounded to me like
>they had Tamboura samples in them - they were very realistic sounding
>too. I was unable to inspect one up close, but I would like to ask if
>anyone on the list has ever got to see one of these to where you
>might be able to tell me if the intervals of the drones could be
>switched to other pitches?

The South Indian musicians that I have seen use them call them "sruti
boxes" (which is the same term some in the North use for the harmonium, I
believe, just to be confusing). The ones I saw do not play samples but what
sounded like filtered sawtooth waves with a slight periodic flange
reminiscent of the tambura. The one I saw had the ability to switch between
sa/pa/sa and sa/ma/sa style drones, though there wasn't a sa/ni/sa. Others
have the ability to select three pitches individually. Of course the tonic
can be tuned to pretty much any pitch in a range of an octave or two.

Also popular these days are CDs of tambura drones alone. I have seen a
72-minute CD of nothing but a tambura drone. Perhaps others have tracks
with different drones and pitch centers that can be continuously looped as
on DJ loop CDs.

>It appears
>that the Indians are very close to some of the Electro/Acoustically
>integrated Classical Music that we have in the West.

Well, a sruti box is more of an inexpensive convenience than
electroacoustic integration. I do know of one South Indian musician who is
trying to popularize the use of synthesizers as solo instruments. After
all, many can be retuned to non-12ET and have a pitch bend wheel (unlike a
harmonium). He has told me, though, that this concept is still very new,
and when he recently delivered a paper on the topic in India, it was
greated with some surprise and skepticism.

Bill

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^ Bill Alves email: alves@hmc.edu ^
^ Harvey Mudd College URL: http://www2.hmc.edu/~alves/ ^
^ 301 E. Twelfth St. (909)607-4170 (office) ^
^ Claremont CA 91711 USA (909)607-7600 (fax) ^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

There is a company that makes drone boxes and tala boxes for practice.
I have a tanpurra (to make things extra Konfusin' ) and prefer it over a
sruti box any day.
though i would kill for a hurdy gurdy tuned to 7 limit JI......(oT)
There is of course the amazing SWARSHALA which does both Tala and Drone
great for practice if you play tabla +bian and Sitar..
I find it is nicer to have a live player --tabla or Tambuora and
tweak from there.
I have missed the initial thread and hope some of this makes sense
cheers

Pat Pagano, Director
South East Just Intonation Society
http://www.geocities.com/experimental_audio_initiative/
http://www.virtulink.com/immp/video/
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Alves <ALVES@ORION.AC.HMC.EDU>
To: <tuning@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2000 7:10 PM
Subject: Re: [tuning] More Droning about Drones: Re: Question about East
Indian Classical Music

>
> >At both of these concerts they were using
> >these little electronic Tamboura boxes to supply the drones. These
> >boxes were about the size of a small jam-box, and sounded to me like
> >they had Tamboura samples in them - they were very realistic sounding
> >too. I was unable to inspect one up close, but I would like to ask if
> >anyone on the list has ever got to see one of these to where you
> >might be able to tell me if the intervals of the drones could be
> >switched to other pitches?
>
> The South Indian musicians that I have seen use them call them "sruti
> boxes" (which is the same term some in the North use for the harmonium, I
> believe, just to be confusing). The ones I saw do not play samples but
what
> sounded like filtered sawtooth waves with a slight periodic flange
> reminiscent of the tambura. The one I saw had the ability to switch
between
> sa/pa/sa and sa/ma/sa style drones, though there wasn't a sa/ni/sa. Others
> have the ability to select three pitches individually. Of course the tonic
> can be tuned to pretty much any pitch in a range of an octave or two.
>
> Also popular these days are CDs of tambura drones alone. I have seen a
> 72-minute CD of nothing but a tambura drone. Perhaps others have tracks
> with different drones and pitch centers that can be continuously looped as
> on DJ loop CDs.
>
> >It appears
> >that the Indians are very close to some of the Electro/Acoustically
> >integrated Classical Music that we have in the West.
>
> Well, a sruti box is more of an inexpensive convenience than
> electroacoustic integration. I do know of one South Indian musician who is
> trying to popularize the use of synthesizers as solo instruments. After
> all, many can be retuned to non-12ET and have a pitch bend wheel (unlike a
> harmonium). He has told me, though, that this concept is still very new,
> and when he recently delivered a paper on the topic in India, it was
> greated with some surprise and skepticism.
>
> Bill
>
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> ^ Bill Alves email: alves@hmc.edu ^
> ^ Harvey Mudd College URL: http://www2.hmc.edu/~alves/ ^
> ^ 301 E. Twelfth St. (909)607-4170 (office) ^
> ^ Claremont CA 91711 USA (909)607-7600 (fax) ^
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>
>
>
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