Yahoo Tuning Groups Ultimate Backup tuning Terpstra NEWS

Hi everyone,

It's been a painful long time since this endeavour was started. A few things happened since, and there are even more exciting news since the last conversation on this topic.

We have 2 more persons interested in buying the keyboard.

I became friends with a young software company that develops a synth just as fresh as the Terpstra: very simple, user-friendly and intuitive, yet powerful and acoustically rich, with an incredible twist in sound computing. They made me a good offer to bundle the synth with the keyboard.

This means that in the Kickstarter campaign there will be one extra slot for the keyboard+synth bundle. In the future, it will be possible to support the Terpstra directly in the synth. This means that the synth would recognize the attached Terpstra and offer a special pull-down menu for different tunings etc. The best part is that I managed to get free updates for all buyers from this first 20 batch. Put simply, buy the synth now at a low price and get the "Terpstra Update" for free when it will be available.

There is one more thing - and this would turn our keyboard into the best controller ever built - but I can't spit it out until I have cleared things with Dylan. It's about adding a cool extra feature but please let's not turn this into a topic.

As for our list, the number could go up to 15 if I make a personal investment and buy 3 more keyboards for myself.

01. Bogdan Constantinescu
02. Carl Lumma
03. Hans Straub
04. Joey Di Nardo
05. Bill Sethares
08. Graham Breed
07. Aaron Wolf
08. Kalle Aho
09. Joel Mandelbaum
10. Leonardo Riveros
11. BogdanÂ´s client #1
12. BogdanÂ´s client #2
13. BogdanÂ´s investment #1
14. BogdanÂ´s investment #2
15. BogdanÂ´s investment #3

This sounds great, but we're still short of 5 people.

I'm in the process of signing some papers with Dylan and that will make me authorized dealer of his product. This means that I will be able to start the Kickstarter campaign, and I can't imagine this campaign being otherwise than successful.

In the mean time I'm continuing the search for investment: fundings, grants, private or anything that would allow us to get to 20.

We're all looking forward to this.

Thank you for being a part of this project.

Bogdan

> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Bogdan" wrote:
> >
> > --- This is a double post from
> > --- "The Xenharmonic Alliance" Facebook Group.
> > --- To see the pictures, follow the link:
> > --- https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=oa.10150998052409482
> >
> >
> > Would you be interested in a limited-edition, not-in-production
> generalised keyboard?
> >
> >
> > Layout: matrix, 2D hexagonal, completely generalised. The geometry of
> the Terpstra keyboard layout is characterized by a vertical shift in
> position between the top surface of a key and the six keys adjacent to
> it. This results in an intuitive feel for changes in pitch as your
> fingers move across the keyboard.
> >
> > Each key has a removable magnetic key cap, so different colored or
> labeled key caps can be easily swapped around when you re-map the keys
> to a different scale.
> >
> > "The main difference with our keyboard is the expressivity allowed by
> the mechanical action of the keys, which is completely different from
> other similar keyboards that had been produced in the past."
> >
> > The key sensing for the Terpstra is one of a kind because the
> electronics constantly monitor the position of every key by magnetically
> sensing for the whole key throw (not by triggering switches at the
> bottom of the key press and measuring the time differential). When a key
> is depressed, the entire change in position is monitored and translated
> to a very accurate and nuanced velocity by the time the key hits the
> bottom.
> >
> > "I am a keyboard player and the feel of the Terpstra was really
> exceptional and had very expressive touch that was lighter but much like
> a real piano, only faster."
> >
> > Every key is easily re-mappable and if mapped to a continuous
> controller, then slowly depressing any re-mapped key sends out
> continuous data like a fader in real time. It does all of this with no
> latency.
> >
> > "Upon seeing it, I could immediately appreciate the manufacturing
> quality of this prototype ï¿½" well made thick aluminum case with a
> look and solidity that is reminiscent of Apple G5 and 8-core towers."
> >
> > Keyboards take a huge amount of abuse during live performance. This
> one is a precision machine built like a tank; it can withstand the
> constant pounding of an energetic concert performance.
> >
> > This innovative and quality controller has a key layout that, unlike
> the Bosanquet, JankÃ³ and other generalized/isomorphic keyboards,
> puts each key at a slightly different height ï¿½" which when combined
> with the irregular shape of the front row of keys, allows you to feel
> where your hands are on the keys without looking. This means that for
> the first time you can play a matrix keyboard without having to
> constantly look at it to know where you are.
> >
> > "I would LOVE to map some keys to sweep filters, and leave other keys
> as notes to trigger the sounds feeding through the filter. This WOULD be
> the funkiest microtonal thing ever!"
> >
> >
> > The product designers who built the only 2 working prototypes are
> ready to take a 20-pieces order. The first one is mine, so there are 19
> "available". The culprit is, it cannot go into production unless there
> are at least 20 buyers.
> >
> > Price: 2189 USD / 1789 EUR
> >
> > Alternatives:
> > C-Thru Music Axis 64 - 2312 USD / 1887 EUR
> > Opal Gecko - 3749 USD / 3060 EUR
> > StarrLabs MicroZone U-648 - 8995 USD / 7365 EUR
> >
>

🔗Carl Lumma <carl@...>

🔗Bogdan <baros_ilogic@...>

The long awaited Terpstra Keyboard is very close to getting into a 20-unit production run.

Although it's been a year since I first started this list, there have been ongoing discussions between me, Dylan Horvath - keyboard's designer and manufacturer, and Siemen Terpstra - keyboard's layout designer, including Johnny Reinhard from the AFFM who originally hired Dylan to make a prototype. We have decided to upgrade and expand the capabilities of the controller by adding a few features:

- Upgrade connectivity to USB and wireless OSC (Open Sound Control - http://opensoundcontrol.org/introduction-osc) in addition to standard MIDI. This would allow a handheld device like a smartphone or tablet to control the settings on the keyboard by changing tunings & creating presets. If a software synthesizer is used, the Terpstra could exchange any information we might think of with it.
- Add RGB LED keycaps that would instantly change color according to layout changes (sold separately).
- To make these possible, a mini computer will be installed onboard. So far the best choice seems to be Raspberry Pi - http://www.raspberrypi.org/faqs - which will further expand connectivity to HDMI, LAN, AUDIO OUT and extra USB.
- Depending on Raspberry Pi's DSP capabilities, the Terpstra Keyboard could generate and send visuals through HDMI output, by creating patterns based on the harmonic relationships between the notes played; it could act like a hardware Synthesia Game when used with the RGB LED color changing keycaps and could also host a real-time synthesizer, generating tones and thus transforming the controller into a musical instrument - though I'm not sure if the hardware could handle that.

The campaign will use the funding platform Indiegogo - http://www.indiegogo.com/ with some of the lower perks filled with bounties for Siemen Terpstra, who made available for this project two of his papers: "The Terpstra Keyboard Design Specifications" (3 pages text, 2 diagrams and 4 color pictures with the cardboard scale models he built) and "Irregular Temperaments and the Division of the Ditonic Comma" (60 pages text, 109 pages with hand drawn diagrams and tables) - a study of 80 historic keyboard tunings, characterized by Johnny Reinhard as the best paper ever written on temperaments. The color pictures could be also used as thank-you greeting cards.

Because we are still not 20 - the minimum number needed for this batch to be produced, I will buy 6 keyboards and make this happen. The price remains the same: 2189 USD. The only thing that keeps me from starting the campaign right now are the added shipping fees, customs (import) and VAT taxes.

The main issue is organizing a campaign with fixed perk price and, as Dylan suggests, shipping not included. This would mean that after contributing to funding, each person will have to pay again for shipping. But the most annoying are the import fees. Dylan points out that there would be 5.4% duty importing into the USA for example, though no one knows for sure. In Denmark, the sum would be around 600-700 extra USD for every kebyoard, not taking shipping into consideration!

I intially calculated the price in Euros having these expenses in mind, but I never imagined it could go so high. My suggestion would be that everyone check which taxes apply to the country they live in, although I cannot agree with buying a partially functional prototype and paying for a musical keyboard. Here is what I mean by that:

The addition of the onboard computer opens the door to a whole lot of new possibilities. The 20 prototypes will be built fully functional from the hardware standpoint, and will be able to operate out-of-the-box. The features that require programming, like OSC, continuous controller keys, color changing keys or whatever new idea we might come up with (provided the hardware can handle it), will be available only after building the keyboards and programming them.

By funding this campaign, you will get one of the 20 fully capable prototypes with regular colored plastic key-caps, which will be able to send MIDI data right from the start. This means that any of them can be used just like any other controller, and with the help of third party (free) software it will play, on whatever layout, in whatever tonality you wish. As development continues, you will receive free updates that will activate missing and extra functions. You could of course program it based on your specific needs, or join the other campaign supporters to create an open-source software community around this concept.

Does anyone know how can a protoype be declared at customs, so as to avoid extra fees?

Would you agree with making a separate payment for shipping?

[this message has also been posted in The Xenharmonic Alliance II Group on Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/groups/xenharmonic2/]

🔗Carl Lumma <carl@...>

Hooray!!

-Carl

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Bogdan" <baros_ilogic@...> wrote:
>
> The long awaited Terpstra Keyboard is very close to getting into a 20-unit production run.
>
> Although it's been a year since I first started this list, there have been ongoing discussions between me, Dylan Horvath - keyboard's designer and manufacturer, and Siemen Terpstra - keyboard's layout designer, including Johnny Reinhard from the AFFM who originally hired Dylan to make a prototype. We have decided to upgrade and expand the capabilities of the controller by adding a few features:
>
> - Upgrade connectivity to USB and wireless OSC (Open Sound Control - http://opensoundcontrol.org/introduction-osc) in addition to standard MIDI. This would allow a handheld device like a smartphone or tablet to control the settings on the keyboard by changing tunings & creating presets. If a software synthesizer is used, the Terpstra could exchange any information we might think of with it.
> - Add RGB LED keycaps that would instantly change color according to layout changes (sold separately).
> - To make these possible, a mini computer will be installed onboard. So far the best choice seems to be Raspberry Pi - http://www.raspberrypi.org/faqs - which will further expand connectivity to HDMI, LAN, AUDIO OUT and extra USB.
> - Depending on Raspberry Pi's DSP capabilities, the Terpstra Keyboard could generate and send visuals through HDMI output, by creating patterns based on the harmonic relationships between the notes played; it could act like a hardware Synthesia Game when used with the RGB LED color changing keycaps and could also host a real-time synthesizer, generating tones and thus transforming the controller into a musical instrument - though I'm not sure if the hardware could handle that.
>
> The campaign will use the funding platform Indiegogo - http://www.indiegogo.com/ with some of the lower perks filled with bounties for Siemen Terpstra, who made available for this project two of his papers: "The Terpstra Keyboard Design Specifications" (3 pages text, 2 diagrams and 4 color pictures with the cardboard scale models he built) and "Irregular Temperaments and the Division of the Ditonic Comma" (60 pages text, 109 pages with hand drawn diagrams and tables) - a study of 80 historic keyboard tunings, characterized by Johnny Reinhard as the best paper ever written on temperaments. The color pictures could be also used as thank-you greeting cards.
>
> Because we are still not 20 - the minimum number needed for this batch to be produced, I will buy 6 keyboards and make this happen. The price remains the same: 2189 USD. The only thing that keeps me from starting the campaign right now are the added shipping fees, customs (import) and VAT taxes.
>
> The main issue is organizing a campaign with fixed perk price and, as Dylan suggests, shipping not included. This would mean that after contributing to funding, each person will have to pay again for shipping. But the most annoying are the import fees. Dylan points out that there would be 5.4% duty importing into the USA for example, though no one knows for sure. In Denmark, the sum would be around 600-700 extra USD for every kebyoard, not taking shipping into consideration!
>
> I intially calculated the price in Euros having these expenses in mind, but I never imagined it could go so high. My suggestion would be that everyone check which taxes apply to the country they live in, although I cannot agree with buying a partially functional prototype and paying for a musical keyboard. Here is what I mean by that:
>
> The addition of the onboard computer opens the door to a whole lot of new possibilities. The 20 prototypes will be built fully functional from the hardware standpoint, and will be able to operate out-of-the-box. The features that require programming, like OSC, continuous controller keys, color changing keys or whatever new idea we might come up with (provided the hardware can handle it), will be available only after building the keyboards and programming them.
>
> By funding this campaign, you will get one of the 20 fully capable prototypes with regular colored plastic key-caps, which will be able to send MIDI data right from the start. This means that any of them can be used just like any other controller, and with the help of third party (free) software it will play, on whatever layout, in whatever tonality you wish. As development continues, you will receive free updates that will activate missing and extra functions. You could of course program it based on your specific needs, or join the other campaign supporters to create an open-source software community around this concept.
>
> Does anyone know how can a protoype be declared at customs, so as to avoid extra fees?
>
> Would you agree with making a separate payment for shipping?
>
> [this message has also been posted in The Xenharmonic Alliance II Group on Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/groups/xenharmonic2/]
>

🔗Mike Battaglia <battaglia01@...>

I forget if I was put on the order list or not. At first I wasn't, but
then later on I'm pretty sure I was. If somehow I didn't get on it,
please please put me on it at once and take all of my money.

Specific comments and exclamations of joy below:

On Sun, Aug 18, 2013 at 4:47 PM, Bogdan <baros_ilogic@...> wrote:
>
> - Upgrade connectivity to USB and wireless OSC (Open Sound Control - http://opensoundcontrol.org/introduction-osc) in addition to standard MIDI. This would allow a handheld device like a smartphone or tablet to control the settings on the keyboard by changing tunings & creating presets. If a software synthesizer is used, the Terpstra could exchange any information we might think of with it.

Yay!

> - Add RGB LED keycaps that would instantly change color according to layout changes (sold separately).

WOOOOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

> - To make these possible, a mini computer will be installed onboard. So far the best choice seems to be Raspberry Pi - http://www.raspberrypi.org/faqs - which will further expand connectivity to HDMI, LAN, AUDIO OUT and extra USB.

OK now I know you're messing with us. There's no way.

> - Depending on Raspberry Pi's DSP capabilities, the Terpstra Keyboard could generate and send visuals through HDMI output, by creating patterns based on the harmonic relationships between the notes played; it could act like a hardware Synthesia Game when used with the RGB LED color changing keycaps and could also host a real-time synthesizer, generating tones and thus transforming the controller into a musical instrument - though I'm not sure if the hardware could handle that.

I don't know how strong the Pi is, but if you guys need a DSP person
to help oversee this process, at least to help out with high level
oversight, I'm your man, as I'm a microtonalist keyboard player who
specializes in DSP.

The thing I would specifically want to help out with is the adjustable
keycap stuff, to ensure that we get something that we can easily
customize to any arbitrary temperament. If you're going to put
presents on this thing, the world would benefit if "porcupine" were
one of them.

> The campaign will use the funding platform Indiegogo - http://www.indiegogo.com/ with some of the lower perks filled with bounties for Siemen Terpstra, who made available for this project two of his papers: "The Terpstra Keyboard Design Specifications" (3 pages text, 2 diagrams and 4 color pictures with the cardboard scale models he built) and "Irregular Temperaments and the Division of the Ditonic Comma" (60 pages text, 109 pages with hand drawn diagrams and tables) - a study of 80 historic keyboard tunings, characterized by Johnny Reinhard as the best paper ever written on temperaments. The color pictures could be also used as thank-you greeting cards.

Just let me know when the thing is up so I can give you all of my money.

> Because we are still not 20 - the minimum number needed for this batch to be produced, I will buy 6 keyboards and make this happen. The price remains the same: 2189 USD. The only thing that keeps me from starting the campaign right now are the added shipping fees, customs (import) and VAT taxes.

If I wasn't on the list before, put me on it and buy 5 keyboards.

> By funding this campaign, you will get one of the 20 fully capable prototypes with regular colored plastic key-caps, which will be able to send MIDI data right from the start. This means that any of them can be used just like any other controller, and with the help of third party (free) software it will play, on whatever layout, in whatever tonality you wish. As development continues, you will receive free updates that will activate missing and extra functions. You could of course program it based on your specific needs, or join the other campaign supporters to create an open-source software community around this concept.

Yes, this is what I want. You say it's going to be user-programmable?
Did I mention I want to be put on the list?

> Does anyone know how can a protoype be declared at customs, so as to avoid extra fees?

I've run into problems at work shipping a single prototype device
that's the size of a cell phone up to Canada. I think you're going to
run into trouble shipping 20 prototypes overseas without having to pay
customs on it.

> Would you agree with making a separate payment for shipping?

How much is shipping?

Mike

🔗Bogdan <baros_ilogic@...>

You are now on the list, Mike.

> I don't know how strong the Pi is, but if you guys need a DSP person
> to help oversee this process, at least to help out with high level
> oversight, I'm your man, as I'm a microtonalist keyboard player who
> specializes in DSP.
>
> The thing I would specifically want to help out with is the adjustable
> keycap stuff, to ensure that we get something that we can easily
> customize to any arbitrary temperament. If you're going to put
> presents on this thing, the world would benefit if "porcupine" were
> one of them.

All we know about it is what they present on their webpage at http://www.raspberrypi.org/faqs

To me, making all this work through MIDI seems complicated so I would suggest we focus on doing it over OSC.

We'll decide together which presets will be defaults, and which colors the plastic keycaps will have. Both plastic and RGB LED keycaps could be mounted on top of every key -no problem.

> I've run into problems at work shipping a single prototype device
> that's the size of a cell phone up to Canada. I think you're going to
> run into trouble shipping 20 prototypes overseas without having to pay
> customs on it.

That's one of my greatest concerns too.

> > Would you agree with making a separate payment for shipping?
>
> How much is shipping?

Dylan estimates it at a few hundreds. I really wish this is an exagerrated estimation...

🔗hstraub64 <straub@...>

Excellent news indeed!

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Bogdan" <baros_ilogic@...> wrote:
>
> > I don't know how strong the Pi is, but if you guys need a DSP
> > person to help oversee this process, at least to help out with
> > high level oversight, I'm your man, as I'm a microtonalist
> > keyboard player who specializes in DSP.
> >
>
> All we know about it is what they present on their webpage at
> http://www.raspberrypi.org/faqs
>
> To me, making all this work through MIDI seems complicated so I
> would suggest we focus on doing it over OSC.

For comparison, I have an Asus EEE 701 4G netbook, which has 512 MB RAM and a 900 MHz processor, comparable to the Raspberry Pi. I managed to put an up-to-date a Linux distribution upon it (Leeenux), including the ALSA driver architecture, which can work with my USB MIDI keyboard as well as my USB-Audio interface (M-Audio Fast Track pro). I brought the ZynAddSubFX software synth to work on it, playable from my USB-MIDI keyboard and sending the sound through the USB-Audio interface. There was some noticeable latency, however. (It may be possible to bring this down with the right parametrization.) It appears to me all this could run on a Raspberry Pi with a similar performance. The ZynAddSunFX softsynth, BTW, has very good and easy-to-use retuning support, so I think there is no need for additional support from this side.

My preferred sound source, which I would like to use with the Terpstra keyboard very much, is still my Roland JV-1010 expander. It supports retuning, done completely separately. I see no need for any additional support for the Terpstra keyboard here - but what I would like is a user-definable remapping of the MIDI notes, including distributing ghe notes to several MIDI channels, for the device supports only 12-note octave scales. Currently I am using the Midi Integrator software ( http://www.altkeyboards.com/integrator ).

As a software deveoper, I would be willing to contribute to the coding (or to try at least).

I don't know how OSC suits in there and whether I would need it. I might learn, however.

As for import, it would be from Canada, right? Gotta look whether I can find some informations about customs fees...
--
Hans Straub

🔗Bogdan <baros_ilogic@...>

Hey Hans,

Your setup is a good model; thank you for your willingness to contribute to the coding. I also thought about expanding Raspberry Pi with a USB Audio Interface.

In factory state, each of Terpstra's 280 keys can be programmed via SYSEX to output any MIDI note (0-127) on any channel (1-16).

Bogdan

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "hstraub64" <straub@...> wrote:
>
> Excellent news indeed!
>
> --- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Bogdan" <baros_ilogic@> wrote:
> >
> > > I don't know how strong the Pi is, but if you guys need a DSP
> > > person to help oversee this process, at least to help out with
> > > high level oversight, I'm your man, as I'm a microtonalist
> > > keyboard player who specializes in DSP.
> > >
> >
> > All we know about it is what they present on their webpage at
> > http://www.raspberrypi.org/faqs
> >
> > To me, making all this work through MIDI seems complicated so I
> > would suggest we focus on doing it over OSC.
>
> For comparison, I have an Asus EEE 701 4G netbook, which has 512 MB RAM and a 900 MHz processor, comparable to the Raspberry Pi. I managed to put an up-to-date a Linux distribution upon it (Leeenux), including the ALSA driver architecture, which can work with my USB MIDI keyboard as well as my USB-Audio interface (M-Audio Fast Track pro). I brought the ZynAddSubFX software synth to work on it, playable from my USB-MIDI keyboard and sending the sound through the USB-Audio interface. There was some noticeable latency, however. (It may be possible to bring this down with the right parametrization.) It appears to me all this could run on a Raspberry Pi with a similar performance. The ZynAddSunFX softsynth, BTW, has very good and easy-to-use retuning support, so I think there is no need for additional support from this side.
>
> My preferred sound source, which I would like to use with the Terpstra keyboard very much, is still my Roland JV-1010 expander. It supports retuning, done completely separately. I see no need for any additional support for the Terpstra keyboard here - but what I would like is a user-definable remapping of the MIDI notes, including distributing ghe notes to several MIDI channels, for the device supports only 12-note octave scales. Currently I am using the Midi Integrator software ( http://www.altkeyboards.com/integrator ).
>
> As a software deveoper, I would be willing to contribute to the coding (or to try at least).
>
> I don't know how OSC suits in there and whether I would need it. I might learn, however.
>
> As for import, it would be from Canada, right? Gotta look whether I can find some informations about customs fees...
> --
> Hans Straub
>