Reply 2 to Graham Breed

Graham Breed said:
> As there is no modulation in Indian music, 436-cents thirds
> will never arise, even if you follow Gregg's highly suspect
> argument.

Alas, the incommensurability of the thirds and fifths in 22-tone equal
does not arise only when modulation is employed, which I have always
been very careful to note. If, taking C as tonic, we tune by fifths of
709 cents, we have a G of 709 cents and a B of 1145 cents. These two
intervals form a 'major third' of 436 cents. 22-tone equal melody is a
tissue of such badly, indeed unrecognizably mistuned consonances. To
pretend that Indian singers use major thirds of 436 cents is
contradicted by all the studies I have seen. They may well use an
interval between the major third and perfect fourth for purposes of
ornament, but certainly not as the usual diatonic interval.

The idea that a static scale ? la just intonation can be employed
melodically so long as one does not modulate, fails to understand that
it is not only in modulation that commensurable consonance is necessary;
the very tissue of melody itself falls apart unless the consonances are
conciliated by temperament. 22-tone equal does not do this, which is one
reason why it is such a poor system.


SMTPOriginator: tuning@eartha.mills.edu
From: Gregg Gibson
Subject: Reply 3 to Graham Breed
PostedDate: 14-12-97 03:16:23
SendTo: CN=coul1358/OU=AT/O=EZH
ReplyTo: tuning@eartha.mills.edu
$MessageStorage: 0
$UpdatedBy: CN=notesrv2/OU=Server/O=EZH,CN=coul1358/OU=AT/O=EZH,CN=Manuel op de Coul/OU=AT/O=EZH
RouteServers: CN=notesrv2/OU=Server/O=EZH,CN=notesrv1/OU=Server/O=EZH
RouteTimes: 14-12-97 03:14:29-14-12-97 03:14:30,14-12-97 03:14:11-14-12-97 03:14:12
DeliveredDate: 14-12-97 03:14:12
Categories:
$Revisions:

Received: from ns.ezh.nl ([137.174.112.59]) by notesrv2.ezh.nl (Lotus SMTP MTA SMTP v4.6 (462.2
9-3-1997)) with SMTP id C125656D.000C4BD7; Sun, 14 Dec 1997 03:16:14 +0100
Received: by ns.ezh.nl; (5.65v3.2/1.3/10May95) id AA14789; Sun, 14 Dec 1997 03:16:23 +0100
Date: Sun, 14 Dec 1997 03:16:23 +0100
Received: from ella.mills.edu by ns (smtpxd); id XA14794
Received: (qmail 101 invoked from network); 13 Dec 1997 18:16:21 -0800
Received: from localhost (HELO ella.mills.edu) (127.0.0.1)
by localhost with SMTP; 13 Dec 1997 18:16:21 -0800
Message-Id: <3493A39E.1697@ww-interlink.net>
Errors-To: madole@mills.edu
Reply-To: tuning@eartha.mills.edu
Originator: tuning@eartha.mills.edu
Sender: tuning@eartha.mills.edu

>4:5:6 is consonant, 4:6:7 and 4:5:7 obviously dissonant - because of the
>constituent intervals. Signed: diabolus in musica.

That's interesting. I've always thought of 4:6:7 as fairly
self-content, but 4:5:7 is most likely dissonant. (Then again dissonance
is context-related whereas discordance is not, but that's a different
discussion altogether.)


SMTPOriginator: tuning@eartha.mills.edu
From: mr88cet@texas.net (Gary Morrison)
Subject: Re: Notation
PostedDate: 15-12-97 15:59:02
SendTo: CN=coul1358/OU=AT/O=EZH
ReplyTo: tuning@eartha.mills.edu
$MessageStorage: 0
$UpdatedBy: CN=notesrv2/OU=Server/O=EZH,CN=coul1358/OU=AT/O=EZH,CN=Manuel op de Coul/OU=AT/O=EZH
RouteServers: CN=notesrv2/OU=Server/O=EZH,CN=notesrv1/OU=Server/O=EZH
RouteTimes: 15-12-97 15:56:58-15-12-97 15:56:59,15-12-97 15:56:39-15-12-97 15:56:40
DeliveredDate: 15-12-97 15:56:40
Categories:
$Revisions:

Received: from ns.ezh.nl ([137.174.112.59]) by notesrv2.ezh.nl (Lotus SMTP MTA SMTP v4.6 (462.2
9-3-1997)) with SMTP id C125656E.00521DAD; Mon, 15 Dec 1997 15:58:51 +0100
Received: by ns.ezh.nl; (5.65v3.2/1.3/10May95) id AA15983; Mon, 15 Dec 1997 15:59:02 +0100
Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 15:59:02 +0100
Received: from ella.mills.edu by ns (smtpxd); id XA15991
Received: (qmail 4537 invoked from network); 15 Dec 1997 06:58:25 -0800
Received: from localhost (HELO ella.mills.edu) (127.0.0.1)
by localhost with SMTP; 15 Dec 1997 06:58:25 -0800
Message-Id:
Errors-To: madole@mills.edu
Reply-To: tuning@eartha.mills.edu
Originator: tuning@eartha.mills.edu
Sender: tuning@eartha.mills.edu