HQ HyperCanvas

Does anyone know if either the Roland HQ Hypercanvas DXi/VSTi or
Roland VSC DXi/VSTi support microtuning via sysex?
I have heard that the VSC Orchestral does, is this true?

V,

{you wrote...}
>Does anyone know if either the Roland HQ Hypercanvas DXi/VSTi or Roland >VSC DXi/VSTi support microtuning via sysex? I have heard that the VSC >Orchestral does, is this true?

I never saw anything about support. Why don't you make it a quest, find out a definitive answer, and report back here? :)

Cheers,
Jon

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan M. Szanto"
<JSZANTO@A...> wrote:
> V,
>
> {you wrote...}
> >Does anyone know if either the Roland HQ Hypercanvas DXi/VSTi or
Roland
> >VSC DXi/VSTi support microtuning via sysex? I have heard that the
VSC
> >Orchestral does, is this true?
>
> I never saw anything about support. Why don't you make it a quest,
find out
> a definitive answer, and report back here? :)
>
> Cheers,
> Jon

Obviously, I was hoping someone here would know the answers, so I
wouldn't have to.
This is all I could find out: VSC Orchestral is definately one of
the best orchestral soundsets out there presently, but expensive.
It has Scale Tune for each Part, and on this you can specify each note
of an octave from -63 to 63 semitones, and save these as custom
presets which can be accessed via MIDI. So it appears that for
orchestral microtonal music, this baby could do the trick.
As far as HQ Hypercanvas, all I could find was sysex coarse and fine
tuning(No scale tune).

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "vquestor" <vquestor@y...>
wrote:
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan M. Szanto"
> <JSZANTO@A...> wrote:
> > V,
> >
> > {you wrote...}
> > >Does anyone know if either the Roland HQ Hypercanvas DXi/VSTi or
> Roland
> > >VSC DXi/VSTi support microtuning via sysex? I have heard that
the
> VSC
> > >Orchestral does, is this true?
> >
> > I never saw anything about support. Why don't you make it a
quest,
> find out
> > a definitive answer, and report back here? :)
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Jon
>
> Obviously, I was hoping someone here would know the answers, so I
> wouldn't have to.
> This is all I could find out: VSC Orchestral is definately one of
> the best orchestral soundsets out there presently, but expensive.
> It has Scale Tune for each Part, and on this you can specify each
note
> of an octave from -63 to 63 semitones, and save these as custom
> presets which can be accessed via MIDI. So it appears that for
> orchestral microtonal music, this baby could do the trick.
> As far as HQ Hypercanvas an VSC, all I could find was sysex coarse
and fine tuning(No scale tune).

Hi,

{you wrote...}
>Obviously, I was hoping someone here would know the answers, so I wouldn't >have to.

I know - please don't take my semi-humorous prods too much to heart! But the worth of any community is how much each of the individuals contribute; I hope that, when we *all* learn from one member's expertise, research, or artistry, that we become compelled to be part of the search as well - in an *active* role.

>This is all I could find out: VSC Orchestral is definately one of the >best orchestral soundsets out there presently, but expensive.

You know, I now remember, late one night, finding that on some pages from the Japanese web-site, and downloading 3 or 4 mp3s of demos of the things. And I have to say that, even though they were fairly skilled, there were a *lot* of places where - as an orchestral performer myself - I absolutely cringed. With their expense (I don't remember the figures, but it *was* high) I would have expected more realistic approximations. Maybe a better 'orchestrator' could have tweeked things, but...

If we can find a sampler somewhere that we can convince them of implementing microtuning, the available sample libraries, along with items like Jacky posted today (good quality multiple-note samples, freely available) will go farther than a set like this.

But then again, everyone's needs are different.

>It has Scale Tune for each Part, and on this you can specify each note of >an octave from -63 to 63 semitones, and save these as custom presets which >can be accessed via MIDI. So it appears that for orchestral microtonal >music, this baby could do the trick.

I'm open to the possibility that better 'orchestral' scores can come out of something like this; I'm personally leery of setups where each note needs to be individually changed and then saved. In the era of Scala/LMSO/MaxMicrotuner it is awfully hard to think about doing that when all I have to do is pick a file from among hundreds to load into a synth, not to mention the ease of creating new ones.

Again, all this is useful, not throwing cold water on your ideas. The search continues!

Cheers,
Jon

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan M. Szanto"
<JSZANTO@A...> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> {you wrote...}
> >Obviously, I was hoping someone here would know the answers, so I
wouldn't
> >have to.
>
> I know - please don't take my semi-humorous prods too much to
heart! But
> the worth of any community is how much each of the individuals
contribute;
> I hope that, when we *all* learn from one member's expertise,
research, or
> artistry, that we become compelled to be part of the search as
well - in an
> *active* role.

Actually, I am a VERY FREQUENT contributer to music forums, but I am
relatively new here. So I HAVE DONE AND DO a lot of searching.

> >This is all I could find out: VSC Orchestral is definately one of
the
> >best orchestral soundsets out there presently, but expensive.
>
> You know, I now remember, late one night, finding that on some
pages from
> the Japanese web-site, and downloading 3 or 4 mp3s of demos of the
things.
> And I have to say that, even though they were fairly skilled, there
were a
> *lot* of places where - as an orchestral performer myself - I
absolutely
> cringed. With their expense (I don't remember the figures, but it
*was*
> high) I would have expected more realistic approximations. Maybe a
better
> 'orchestrator' could have tweeked things, but...

I think for you to make an honest evaluation, you would have to
try the program, and not judge by an MP3. Unfortunately I can't
find a demo to download from Edirol. I have read reviews from
owner's of the program, where they rated it as probably the best, or
one of the best orchestral soundsets available.

> If we can find a sampler somewhere that we can convince them of
> implementing microtuning, the available sample libraries, along
with items
> like Jacky posted today (good quality multiple-note samples, freely
> available) will go farther than a set like this.

Yes, I agree 100%, but I would also need compatibility to Midi program
and Bank change messages. I have approached both "LiveSynth Pro"
and "Vsampler3", but still, no response. This is very unfortunate,
because all of the technology is finally here, but no one to write
the specific code for these features.

> But then again, everyone's needs are different.
>
> >It has Scale Tune for each Part, and on this you can specify each
note of
> >an octave from -63 to 63 semitones, and save these as custom
presets which
> >can be accessed via MIDI. So it appears that for orchestral
microtonal
> >music, this baby could do the trick.
>
> I'm open to the possibility that better 'orchestral' scores can
come out of
> something like this; I'm personally leery of setups where each note
needs
> to be individually changed and then saved.

I hope you understand that these are saved as an octave and apply to
all octaves of a particular PART. I don't know if these can be linked
together as one sysex for all PARTs(except,of course,the drum PART),
and saved. Certainly, if it cannot, can't someone make a SCALA
convertor to use with it?

In the era of
> Scala/LMSO/MaxMicrotuner it is awfully hard to think about doing
that when
> all I have to do is pick a file from among hundreds to load into a
synth,
> not to mention the ease of creating new ones.
>
> Again, all this is useful, not throwing cold water on your ideas.
The
> search continues!
>
> Cheers,
> Jon

Vquestor (gee, if I knew a name, if that isn't it, I'd use it to be less formal),

{you wrote...}
>Actually, I am a VERY FREQUENT contributer to music forums, but I am >relatively new here. So I HAVE DONE AND DO a lot of searching.

Even if it was unintentional, my apologies - I meant no slight on your contributions, and only want everyone to join in the search. For anyone new to the tuning lists, etc, I certainly understand your wanting to ask others.

>I think for you to make an honest evaluation, you would have to try the >program, and not judge by an MP3.

I don't doubt that. But without downloadable demos, it just isn't possible (did I miss a demo somewhere?) and then all you can do is listen. These were demos straight from the manufacturer, most assuredly intending to show the soundset to the best advantage. I'm sorry that I found it lacking, maybe your feelings would be different. Then again, I have an awkward bias, which is that I play live orchestral music for my profession, and there isn't anything that really nails (yet) a live orchestra. Close, but that is all it is.

>Yes, I agree 100%, but I would also need compatibility to Midi program and >Bank change messages.

One other thing: sometimes we may need to re-think the way we work with these tools - if a sampler came along that had great samples but didn't support the above, would you consider it?

>I have approached both "LiveSynth Pro" and "Vsampler3", but still, no >response.

I read on another list that LiveSynth Pro has gone under - know anything?

>This is very unfortunate, because all of the technology is finally here, >but no one to write the specific code for these features.

They may be there, they may just not think it is important. *That* for me is the big hurdle to overcome. I don't have the answer for it; either huge numbers of requests (not likely) or examples of great music that could be done (only slightly more likely) might convince them.

>I hope you understand that these are saved as an octave and apply to all >octaves of a particular PART. I don't know if these can be linked together >as one sysex for all PARTs(except,of course,the drum PART), and >saved. Certainly, if it cannot, can't someone make a SCALA convertor to >use with it?

Possibly. From my years on the list, the implementation of scales as only "per octave" (i.e. repeated tunings of no more than 12 notes) is pretty much dissed around here. And, frankly, there are so many tunings that need more than 12 notes per octave that I wouldn't encourage any developer to follow that format.

We'll keep at it, right? And let me know if I happen to step on anyone's toes (without good reason!).

Cheers,
Jon

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan M. Szanto"
<JSZANTO@A...> wrote:
> Vquestor (gee, if I knew a name, if that isn't it, I'd use it to be
less
> formal),

>
> {you wrote...}
> >Actually, I am a VERY FREQUENT contributer to music forums, but I
am
> >relatively new here. So I HAVE DONE AND DO a lot of searching.
>
> Even if it was unintentional, my apologies - I meant no slight on
your
> contributions, and only want everyone to join in the search. For
anyone new
> to the tuning lists, etc, I certainly understand your wanting to
ask others.

Jon,
No offense taken. I just wanted to clarify that I usually do more
than my share of searching, and will continue to do so.

>
> >I think for you to make an honest evaluation, you would have to
try the
> >program, and not judge by an MP3.
>
> I don't doubt that. But without downloadable demos, it just isn't
possible
> (did I miss a demo somewhere?) and then all you can do is listen.
These
> were demos straight from the manufacturer, most assuredly intending
to show
> the soundset to the best advantage. I'm sorry that I found it
lacking,
> maybe your feelings would be different. Then again, I have an
awkward bias,
> which is that I play live orchestral music for my profession, and
there
> isn't anything that really nails (yet) a live orchestra. Close, but
that is
> all it is.
>
> >Yes, I agree 100%, but I would also need compatibility to Midi
program and
> >Bank change messages.
>
> One other thing: sometimes we may need to re-think the way we work
with
> these tools - if a sampler came along that had great samples but
didn't
> support the above, would you consider it?

I would prefer not to, but would consider it if it were the only thing
available, and at an affordable price.

> >I have approached both "LiveSynth Pro" and "Vsampler3", but still,
no
> >response.
>
> I read on another list that LiveSynth Pro has gone under - know
anything?

This is very very bad news. I just did some searches and can't find
www.livesynth.com and www.liveupdate.com!!!!
>
> >This is very unfortunate, because all of the technology is finally
here,
> >but no one to write the specific code for these features.
>
> They may be there, they may just not think it is important. *That*
for me
> is the big hurdle to overcome. I don't have the answer for it;
either huge
> numbers of requests (not likely) or examples of great music that
could be
> done (only slightly more likely) might convince them.
>
> >I hope you understand that these are saved as an octave and apply
to all
> >octaves of a particular PART. I don't know if these can be linked
together
> >as one sysex for all PARTs(except,of course,the drum PART), and
> >saved. Certainly, if it cannot, can't someone make a SCALA
convertor to
> >use with it?
>
> Possibly. From my years on the list, the implementation of scales
as only
> "per octave" (i.e. repeated tunings of no more than 12 notes) is
pretty
> much dissed around here. And, frankly, there are so many tunings
that need
> more than 12 notes per octave that I wouldn't encourage any
developer to
> follow that format.

That's interesting. Thank you for the clarification.

>
> We'll keep at it, right? And let me know if I happen to step on
anyone's
> toes (without good reason!).

Cheerio!
>
> Cheers,
> Jon

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "vquestor" <vquestor@y...>
wrote:

> and on this you can specify each note
> of an octave from -63 to 63 semitones,

odd . . . maybe you meant -63 to +63 in units of 1/64 of a semitone?
or 1/128 of a semitone? or cents?

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Erlich" <perlich@a...>
wrote:
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "vquestor" <vquestor@y...>
> wrote:
>
> > and on this you can specify each note
> > of an octave from -63 to 63 semitones,
>
> odd . . . maybe you meant -63 to +63 in units of 1/64 of a
semitone?
> or 1/128 of a semitone? or cents?

Sorry, you are right, I think it is cents.