Question on a sampler purchase (used)

Gang,

I've been wanting the options a sampler affords for a while, and for a number of reasons it will make most sense for me to go the hardware route as opposed to software (such as GigaSampler).

So I see today in the local paper, in the used musical instruments, the following spec:

Akai S5000, HD, USB, 136MB - $1000

Is this something I should go for? It's within my budget, and Akai seems pretty industry-standard. I know a number of you have worked or still work with hardware boxes (Jacky, you have an earlier model, no?), so any advice would be appreciated, both in terms of this model being all-around well-suited, and if the price seems reasonable.

Cheers,
Jon

At 09:26 PM 5/16/2002 +0000, you wrote:
>I've been wanting the options a sampler affords for a while, and for a
number of reasons it will make most sense for me to go the hardware route
as opposed to software (such as GigaSampler).

Well... since the Akai is basically a dedicated rack mount computer; you might as well get a rack mount case for a PC and call it a day... just as portable! ;) You can always upgrade your PC, but you are out of luck with the S5000 and it is aging quickly.

>Akai S5000, HD, USB, 136MB - $1000
>Is this something I should go for?

--------------------------------

No; in my opinion...

I have had the S6000 for two years which is functionally the same as the S5000; especially after USB support was added to the series. It was great sampler to learn on, but there are many frustrating aspects.. 12 note retuning, limited external midi control of parameters (only 1 external CC that controls only 1 of a few selected parameters), 20 bit A/D/A, filters are ok at best, limited to 256 megs RAM (can play from disk, but this is a limiting factor; SIMMS are expensive unless you know anyone who has 64meg ones laying around.)

Assuming you already have a PC I would highly recommend spending ~$1000 on the following upgrades (motherboard, CPU, RAM, Kontakt, & audio device):

Asus A7V333 Via KT333 $112 http://www.qbitpc.com/
Athlon XP 2100+ $211 http://www.sonicparts.com/
PC2700 DDR RAM 512 megs $114 http://www.pcsupplysource.com/
$339 on NI Kontakt... www.audiomidi.com or numerous online stores.

All of the above for:
~$776

For those running PCs
~$437 is not "that bad" of an upgrade to the latest considering that your current MB/CPU/RAM could be sold for $100 to $150 depending on what it is.. Jacky.. you'll be composing with softsynths on the fly; audio bounce down -- huh?! ;)

If you want to go the extra mile:
Snag a Delta 44
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=871266875

or here:
for $229... www.audiomidi.com

will have to also pick up a midi hub of some sort...
Midisport 2X2 $59 www.audiomidi.com

I will be glad to sell you my Aardvark Q10 for $350 (http://www.aardvarkaudio.com/aasd-v1/products/q10-main.html); bought it for $700 6 months ago... I am not using it, but it came bundled with a full version of Cakewalk Pro Audio 9.0. Recommend Cubase SX (available soon).
This offer is open for anyone here by the way...

Check this out: http://members.rogers.com/mlomas/2Scard.html (you can probably find cheaper prices if you search)...

--------------------------------

>In a non-commercial way, no. You want to kick in the $$$ for a dedicated
server with mp3 streaming capabilities.

I understand the Shoutcast server is free... Bandwidth is your only cost (business DSL? $70/month?)..

For those with DSL/cable checkout shoutcast (www.shoutcast.com) and do a search for contemporary classical (http://www.shoutcast.com/directory/?sgenre=Contemporary). There is a really nice station out of Germany (DRavantgarde: IREM version 1 avantgarde) that is streaming quality music. Only 3 people max can listen at once... :(

-------------------------

Recently I have recorded the Jomox Airbase99 and Vermona DRM1 MKII analog drum machines through my Empirical Labs Distressor and made some nice sample sets at 24/48. I'll be glad to share with those interested in beat oriented madness..

I'll answer more on Kontakt by next weekend and provide some sound clips... Nasty "real world" week ahead... starting now... :(

Best,
--Mike

Egregious
"Spiritual renewal through music for those outside the heard."
http://www.egregious.net/

--- In MakeMicroMusic@y..., Jonathan Szanto <JSZANTO@A...>
wrote:
> Gang,
>
> I've been wanting the options a sampler affords for a while,
and for a
> number of reasons it will make most sense for me to go the
hardware route
> as opposed to software (such as GigaSampler).
>
> So I see today in the local paper, in the used musical
instruments, the
> following spec:
>
> Akai S5000, HD, USB, 136MB - $1000
>
> Is this something I should go for? It's within my budget, and
Akai seems
> pretty industry-standard. I know a number of you have worked
or still work
> with hardware boxes (Jacky, you have an earlier model, no?),
so any advice
> would be appreciated, both in terms of this model being
all-around
> well-suited, and if the price seems reasonable.
>
> Cheers,
> Jon

If you ca find an Ensinq ASR-X or and ASR 10 I would go for that.

Both are very microtunable. The X has better tuning accuracy that
the ASR 10 [0.37 cents compared to 1.56 cents] but it does not
have a keyboard attached to it. It does have some bashable
percussion pads on it . Only 13 of them though.

IMO the best option is to get some sort of softsampler like
reaktor or some such and then use the hardware sampler to
play all these sounds from. No softare sampler will give you the
polyphony of a hardware sampler and no hardware sampler will
give you as much sound design flexibility as a software sampler.

You need both!

Justin

Mike, Mike Mike - what would I/we do without you?

>Well... since the Akai is basically a dedicated rack mount computer; you
>might as well get a rack mount case for a PC and call it a day... just as
>portable! ;) You can always upgrade your PC, but you are out of luck with
>the S5000 and it is aging quickly.

OK, here goes. Yep, I figure the S5000 was either out or on it's way out, looking at online retailers for info/prices and they didn't have it. And it isn't that much fun investing in something that is neither "right now" or vintage technology.

But - sure, I'm going to use this 'at home', but one of my primary reasons for the sampler is as follows: I play live, orchestral music. I'm the head percussionist, and frequently there is need for the sound of instruments that we just don't have. The most recent one was the ambiguously described "low bells" in Mahler's Sixth Symphony. Yes, with a combination of about 3 hardware boxes and my sound system I put together a credible simulation of very low church bells, but sometimes there just isn't a substitute for the real timbre of something, even if you end up transporting the pitch up or down. I know, because I've rented/borrowed equipment and done some sound design.

Not to mention sounds that can't be described but you know can be put together with samples or samples and synthesis together. And very occasionally, like for the Opera company, I contract to do a sound or sound design that one of their people will perform: I program, set up the gear, and they have to play it.

Do I have faith these days in hardware boxes? Yes.

Do I have faith these days in operating systems and software design. Not when it has to work every time, all the time!

You get my dilemma.

If you have any thoughts on the stability (hey, I'm sure running these software samplers could be done with my P4 laptop running W2000 Pro, but...

But - and that's a humongous but - I value the thoughts about software solutions and won't go forward without thinking some more about it.

>12 note retuning

Never mind... !!!

>$339 on NI Kontakt... www.audiomidi.com or numerous online stores.

This is just starting to be discussed on the list, so I'm definitely going to check it out. Maybe tonight.

>will have to also pick up a midi hub of some sort...
>Midisport 2X2 $59 www.audiomidi.com

I'm using a MidiSport 4x4 with my laptop...

>I will be glad to sell you my Aardvark Q10 for $350
>(http://www.aardvarkaudio.com/aasd-v1/products/q10-main.html); bought it
>for $700 6 months ago... I am not using it, but it came bundled with a
>full version of Cakewalk Pro Audio 9.0. Recommend Cubase SX (available soon).
>This offer is open for anyone here by the way...

I'll take a look at their website tonight, that is tempting. My last "top of the line system" sported an Echo Gina card, but for whatever reason my latest computer (with an Asus MB and other stuff) keeps locking with a hardware conflict. So I've only got a basic sound card, and have to do my digital audio on a lesser platform. So Mom's interested...

>Recently I have recorded the Jomox Airbase99 and Vermona DRM1 MKII analog
>drum machines through my Empirical Labs Distressor and made some nice
>sample sets at 24/48. I'll be glad to share with those interested in beat
>oriented madness..

Hell, since I don't have a sampler, I'd be even happy to hear an mp3 demo of some of the work!

>I'll answer more on Kontakt by next weekend and provide some sound clips...

Cool.

>Nasty "real world" week ahead... starting now... :(

Hah - beat ya! Mine started earlier today!

Cheers,
Jon