Yahoo Tuning Groups Ultimate Backup makemicromusic Korg MS2000 question

---This synth natively has various tunings, including just intonations, and

---arbitrary frequency assignment, but for 12 keys only I think.
I know the feeling, my Yamaha CS6X has the same issue.

My best attempts have involved fine-tuning each of the 12 keys up or down a few cents (like you have suggested)...which is fine so long as you want 12-or-less note available in the scale.
If you are going mono-phonic, you can take a channel and bend it up, say, a quarter tone to turn 12TET into the other set of 12 notes in 24TET, for example, or fine-tune those notes to set tunings like 22-tone Indian working. You just have to execute a quick "silent" pitch bend right before you hit those "other 12 notes".

I would encourage you strongly to try
A) putting notes close to each other on opposite sides of the stereo spectrum for clarity
B) experimenting with sine wave tones and checking for beating to get a feel for which intervals in a scale (or to make a scale) have a distinct sound IE don't just mash together.

Some people who are truly visionary can manage to that scales like 31TET and string together chords that hover between different sets of 7-8 notes, thus composing by evolving chords and never staying in a consistent "scale" but rather constantly morph between scales. Such people are modern day Debussy's; and if any of you are here I would love to know the methods behind the madness.

And....I am not one of such people, though, and I would strongly suggest you start with the concept of just sorting 7-9 notes within a tuning, in which case constant per-key fine-tuning should work just fine for emulation.

-Michael

--- On Mon, 11/17/08, Chris Vaisvil <chrisvaisvil@...> wrote:
From: Chris Vaisvil <chrisvaisvil@...>
Subject: [MMM] Korg MS2000 question
To: "MMM" <MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Monday, November 17, 2008, 6:41 AM

Does anyone have experience with using Scala 2+ to retune the Korg MS2000

synth?

This synth natively has various tunings, including just intonations, and

arbitrary frequency assignment, but for 12 keys only I think.

Some doors are opening up here and I must admit I'm itching to try some more

microtonal composition.

Thanks,

Chris

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

🔗Chris Vaisvil <chrisvaisvil@...>

Thanks for the tips.

Debussy took the tone coloration of late romanticism to its logical
conclusion by use non-functional harmony as pure tone color. Another way to
say this is - one doesn't choose a note because a scale or tonal harmony
dictates it.

http://clones.soonlabel.com/class/strings.mp3

(yes it spam, improvisation on a CZ-101 along these lines - not micro,
sorry.)

On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 12:51 PM, Michael Sheiman
<djtrancendance@...>wrote:

>
> ---This synth natively has various tunings, including just intonations, and
>
>
>
> I would encourage you strongly to try
> A) putting notes close to each other on opposite sides of the stereo
> spectrum for clarity
> B) experimenting with sine wave tones and checking for beating to get a
> feel for which intervals in a scale (or to make a scale) have a distinct
> sound IE don't just mash together.
>
> Some people who are truly visionary can manage to that scales like
> 31TET and string together chords that hover between different sets of 7-8
> notes, thus composing by evolving chords and never staying in a consistent
> "scale" but rather constantly morph between scales. Such people are modern
> day Debussy's; and if any of you are here I would love to know the methods
> behind the madness.
>
> And....I am not one of such people, though, and I would strongly
> suggest you start with the concept of just sorting 7-9 notes within a
> tuning, in which case constant per-key fine-tuning should work just fine for
> emulation.
>
> -Michael
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

🔗Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...>

I would say Satie would have to be mentioned along Debussy in regard to using harmony for color as opposed to function. But the two spent time together

The main problem with music with thick chords wandering where one wishes is more technological/financial than peoples ears or desires.
Diamonds and combination product sets offer much in this direction

As an aside i played a game of bibliomancy a while ago with a friend. where you ask a question and you open up a book for the answer.

Q: how will music sound in 100 years:
A: heightened by Wagnerian influences

regardless i become more and more interested in less notes in a scale as opposed to more. a 22 tone scale might be a good limit holding an eikosany

/^_,',',',_ //^ /Kraig Grady_ ^_,',',',_
Mesotonal Music from:
_'''''''_ ^North/Western Hemisphere: North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>

_'''''''_ ^South/Eastern Hemisphere:
Austronesian Outpost of Anaphoria <http://anaphoriasouth.blogspot.com/>

',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',

Chris Vaisvil wrote:
>
> Thanks for the tips.
>
> Debussy took the tone coloration of late romanticism to its logical
> conclusion by use non-functional harmony as pure tone color. Another > way to
> say this is - one doesn't choose a note because a scale or tonal harmony
> dictates it.
>
> http://clones.soonlabel.com/class/strings.mp3 > <http://clones.soonlabel.com/class/strings.mp3>
>
> (yes it spam, improvisation on a CZ-101 along these lines - not micro,
> sorry.)
>
> On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 12:51 PM, Michael Sheiman
> <djtrancendance@... <mailto:djtrancendance%40yahoo.com>>wrote:
>
> >
> > ---This synth natively has various tunings, including just > intonations, and
> >
> >
> >
> > I would encourage you strongly to try
> > A) putting notes close to each other on opposite sides of the stereo
> > spectrum for clarity
> > B) experimenting with sine wave tones and checking for beating to get a
> > feel for which intervals in a scale (or to make a scale) have a distinct
> > sound IE don't just mash together.
> >
> > Some people who are truly visionary can manage to that scales like
> > 31TET and string together chords that hover between different sets > of 7-8
> > notes, thus composing by evolving chords and never staying in a > consistent
> > "scale" but rather constantly morph between scales. Such people are > modern
> > day Debussy's; and if any of you are here I would love to know the > methods
> > behind the madness.
> >
> > And....I am not one of such people, though, and I would strongly
> > suggest you start with the concept of just sorting 7-9 notes within a
> > tuning, in which case constant per-key fine-tuning should work just > fine for
> > emulation.
> >
> > -Michael
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

🔗Chris Vaisvil <chrisvaisvil@...>

Satie I more associate with the start of the minimalist movements but I
guess he had non-functional harmony also. (White key music I think) I'm on
uncertain ground because, unlike Debussy where we analyzed several pieces,
we only took a cursory glance at one Satie piece and discussed his world
oratorio I think. (But I can't find a reference to that oratorio - perhaps
someone else's. Forgive me - it was 30 years ago and I have taken physical
chemistry in between then and now.)

You made me look up some terminology! Right now I've been listening to Prent
Rodgers excellent CD he so graciously sent to me. He has a number of pieces
dealing with tonality diamonds (if I got that right). I'm still trying to
figure out how the puzzle fits together. I do think that I need to get my
hands on the ability to experiment in micro scales.

To bring in a previous conversation - re:the thick chords - I think volume
with respect to pitch is part of the answer. - Nothing says all pitches have
to be at the same volume in a chord for a given timbre.

And 20, 22 notes - sounds like a lot.

Impressive wiki page Kraig!

Chris

On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 2:46 PM, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...>wrote:

> I would say Satie would have to be mentioned along Debussy in regard to
> using harmony for color as opposed to function. But the two spent time
> together
>
> The main problem with music with thick chords wandering where one
> wishes is more technological/financial than peoples ears or desires.
> Diamonds and combination product sets offer much in this direction
>
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

🔗Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...>

Some of his best known pieces give that impression of Satie. He is quite good at using secession of chords just based on the color. He had one method where he took each interval and figure out progressions he liked the most and would put chains of these two chord segments together based only on the melody and not the harmony. You can not tell this listening.
Try finding
Premiere pensee et sommeries de la rose+croix
and

pieces friodes

i agree about the volume thing but also timbre too!

/^_,',',',_ //^ /Kraig Grady_ ^_,',',',_
Mesotonal Music from:
_'''''''_ ^North/Western Hemisphere: North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>

_'''''''_ ^South/Eastern Hemisphere:
Austronesian Outpost of Anaphoria <http://anaphoriasouth.blogspot.com/>

',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',',

Chris Vaisvil wrote:
>
> Satie I more associate with the start of the minimalist movements but I
> guess he had non-functional harmony also. (White key music I think) I'm on
> uncertain ground because, unlike Debussy where we analyzed several pieces,
> we only took a cursory glance at one Satie piece and discussed his world
> oratorio I think. (But I can't find a reference to that oratorio - perhaps
> someone else's. Forgive me - it was 30 years ago and I have taken physical
> chemistry in between then and now.)
>
> You made me look up some terminology! Right now I've been listening to > Prent
> Rodgers excellent CD he so graciously sent to me. He has a number of > pieces
> dealing with tonality diamonds (if I got that right). I'm still trying to
> figure out how the puzzle fits together. I do think that I need to get my
> hands on the ability to experiment in micro scales.
>
> To bring in a previous conversation - re:the thick chords - I think volume
> with respect to pitch is part of the answer. - Nothing says all > pitches have
> to be at the same volume in a chord for a given timbre.
>
> And 20, 22 notes - sounds like a lot.
>
> Impressive wiki page Kraig!
>
> Chris
>
> On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 2:46 PM, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@... > <mailto:kraiggrady%40anaphoria.com>>wrote:
>
> > I would say Satie would have to be mentioned along Debussy in regard to
> > using harmony for color as opposed to function. But the two spent time
> > together
> >
> > The main problem with music with thick chords wandering where one
> > wishes is more technological/financial than peoples ears or desires.
> > Diamonds and combination product sets offer much in this direction
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

🔗Michael Sheiman <djtrancendance@...>

For the record, even though it's not technically micro-tonal I actually think it is still relevant...since much of the beauty of huge tunings like 31-TET are the vast number of combinations of chords and modulations possible. Nice contribution!

--- On Mon, 11/17/08, Chris Vaisvil <chrisvaisvil@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Chris Vaisvil <chrisvaisvil@...>
Subject: Re: [MMM] Korg MS2000 question
To: MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, November 17, 2008, 11:01 AM

Thanks for the tips.

Debussy took the tone coloration of late romanticism to its logical

conclusion by use non-functional harmony as pure tone color. Another way to

say this is - one doesn't choose a note because a scale or tonal harmony

dictates it.

http://clones. soonlabel. com/class/ strings.mp3

(yes it spam, improvisation on a CZ-101 along these lines - not micro,

sorry.)

On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 12:51 PM, Michael Sheiman

<djtrancendance@ yahoo.com>wrote:

> ---This synth natively has various tunings, including just intonations, and

> I would encourage you strongly to try

> A) putting notes close to each other on opposite sides of the stereo

> spectrum for clarity

> B) experimenting with sine wave tones and checking for beating to get a

> feel for which intervals in a scale (or to make a scale) have a distinct

> sound IE don't just mash together.

> Some people who are truly visionary can manage to that scales like

> 31TET and string together chords that hover between different sets of 7-8

> notes, thus composing by evolving chords and never staying in a consistent

> "scale" but rather constantly morph between scales. Such people are modern

> day Debussy's; and if any of you are here I would love to know the methods

> behind the madness.

> And....I am not one of such people, though, and I would strongly

> suggest you start with the concept of just sorting 7-9 notes within a

> tuning, in which case constant per-key fine-tuning should work just fine for

> emulation.

> -Michael

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Korg MS2000 question

🔗Chris Vaisvil <chrisvaisvil@...>

🔗David Beardsley <db@...>

🔗Michael Sheiman <djtrancendance@...>

🔗Chris Vaisvil <chrisvaisvil@...>

🔗Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...>

🔗Chris Vaisvil <chrisvaisvil@...>

🔗Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...>

🔗Michael Sheiman <djtrancendance@...>