Re:Free sample of new tuning theory I've been working on...and any ideas

Charles (and anyone else interested),

The ratios for my 12 Modulated Temperament are (fine tuned by ear...so left in decimal rather than fractional format)

A5 1
B5 1.125
C5 1.142
D5 1.187
E5 1.212
F5 1.245
G5 1.3333
H5 1.5
I5 1.615
J5 1.6666
K5 1.8
L5 1.89777
A6 2

Note, at least to my ear, I5 and C5 are the most sour notes by a good margin...feel free to find better ratios for these: in fact I would greatly appreciate it.

Also, I will upload a demo song I have made for this scale soon...
Although for now the current version of the demo song is on http://www.traxinspace.com/profile/spectra under the song name "12 MT"...I believe you have to register to download it. :-(

On the plus side (for joining that site) a few artists such as Clones, Warrior Bob, and myself are all interest in making micro-tonal music, and I know a couple of others who admire it even though they have no clue how to make it. So if you're looking for an alternative venue to show your micro-tonal works to the world, TIS is actually not a half bad place to start. :-)

All the best, Michael

Charles Lucy <lucy@...> wrote: Hi Michael;

OK I've taken the bait;-)

So where are the tuning values, and the url?

I thought I had solved all the microtuning with harmony problems
already, at least for those with the patience to plough their way
through the site and apply the values ;-)

http://www.lcuytune.com

best wishes

If the any software/synthesizer package any of you know of that will
dynamically change the timbre of an instrument to calculate the
clearest possible timbre for any given scale (including non equally
tempered scale) and change to it/calculate it differently for each
note in the scale according to whatever scale you give it

The good news is I have managed to come up with a 12 note scale able
to be played harmonically with about 10/12 being consistently in tune
with each other (IE overtones are within about 8-cents of overlap with
each other).
The bad news is about two notes seem off/"wolf-ish" and I am hoping to
find a way to get them sounding consonant so hopefully they will be
adopted for use on traditional looking keyboards and synthesizers.

All my work, including this special tuning (song title called 12MT or
"modulated temperament") and one song written in harmonized 8-note
subset scales of 19TET called "Melancholy in Yellow"...is on
Traxinspace.com under the artist name "Spectra".

And, no I don't get paid a dime for my free work on that site...nor
would I really care if I did.
Moreover, I am simply very eager to find a micro-tonal scale that is
both consonant enough to be commercially viable and also providing
enough tonal freedom to allow the more diverse melodic progressions
and moods possible in micro-tonal and exotic scales such as 22TET. So
we I could appreciate a wider world of possibilities in moods we hear
in, say, songs on the radio or at major concerts and live venues. And
I would, of course, appreciate any help in making that happen. :-)

...With all the expressive technology we have nowadays, it's a miracle
95% of the world still uses variations of the same old tuning they've
been using since the 1400's. :-D

Charles Lucy
lucy@...

- Promoting global harmony through LucyTuning -

for information on LucyTuning go to:
http://www.lucytune.com

For LucyTuned Lullabies go to:
http://www.lullabies.co.uk

---------------------------------
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Hi Michael,

>Charles (and anyone else interested),
>
>The ratios for my 12 Modulated Temperament are (fine tuned by ear...so
>left in decimal rather than fractional format)
>
>A5 1
>B5 1.125
>C5 1.142
>D5 1.187
>E5 1.212
>F5 1.245
>G5 1.3333
>H5 1.5
>I5 1.615
>J5 1.6666
>K5 1.8
>L5 1.89777
>A6 2

I'd write it like this:

!
Michael Sheiman's "12-MT" scale.
12
!
9/8
229.875
296.784
332.868
379.375
4/3
3/2
829.841
5/3
9/5
1109.166
2/1
!

This uses rationals and cents instead of your decimal
factors. There's nothing wrong with decimal factors, but
microtonal musicians are typically more familiar with
cents and rational numbers. The above is also in Scala
scale file format (if you paste it into a text file
with .scl extension).

One thing about this scale is that it isn't very close
to 12-ET. The first step is a whole tone not a half
tone, and there's a very small step after that.

> Note, at least to my ear, I5 and C5 are the most sour notes by a
>good margin...feel free to find better ratios for these: in fact I
>would greatly appreciate it.
>
> Also, I will upload a demo song I have made for this scale soon...

Great!

-Carl

Charles and Carl,
Ok I finally have a copy of the demo harmonized melody of 12 tone modulated up: http://geocities.com/djtrancendance/microtonal/12mt2.mp3
Enjoy!

You might notice subtle changes of notes and mood each time the main melody is played, intended to enhance the mood flexibility limits beyond that of Western tunings.
>>>>>
Although the timbre overtones vs. root notes don't always match hence I'd appreciate it if anyone would help me
A) Come up with a theory of building chords in the scale (not by solely ear, as I have done)
B) Come up with a theory of the ideal timbre/overtone frequency multiples for each note in the scale...to produce ideal "Just-Intonation"-like consonance on electronic instruments
<<<<<<<

Also, for the record, in case by odd chance it gets anywhere, I would rather not call it "Mike's scale" or anything else slightly ego-centric...
I would rather just say that if any people have ideas for enhancing the scale I would greatly appreciate it if they contacted me to tell me what they are doing (in the same way Linus has "creative control ownership" of Linux).

Carl,
Thanks for the proper "scala" restatement of the scale...hopefully it will make reading it a bit easier for everyone else. :-)
Actually, for future reference (since the program I use to do microtonal, the OPENMPT tracker, uses decimals not cents for micro-tunings), what's the conversion formula from decimals to cents and, for complex fractions like 369/367, from decimals to fractions?

-Michael

Carl Lumma <carl@...> wrote: Hi Michael,

>Charles (and anyone else interested),
>
>The ratios for my 12 Modulated Temperament are (fine tuned by ear...so
>left in decimal rather than fractional format)
>
>A5 1
>B5 1.125
>C5 1.142
>D5 1.187
>E5 1.212
>F5 1.245
>G5 1.3333
>H5 1.5
>I5 1.615
>J5 1.6666
>K5 1.8
>L5 1.89777
>A6 2

I'd write it like this:

!
Michael Sheiman's "12-MT" scale.
12
!
9/8
229.875
296.784
332.868
379.375
4/3
3/2
829.841
5/3
9/5
1109.166
2/1
!

This uses rationals and cents instead of your decimal
factors. There's nothing wrong with decimal factors, but
microtonal musicians are typically more familiar with
cents and rational numbers. The above is also in Scala
scale file format (if you paste it into a text file
with .scl extension).

One thing about this scale is that it isn't very close
to 12-ET. The first step is a whole tone not a half
tone, and there's a very small step after that.

> Note, at least to my ear, I5 and C5 are the most sour notes by a
>good margin...feel free to find better ratios for these: in fact I
>would greatly appreciate it.
>
> Also, I will upload a demo song I have made for this scale soon...

Great!

-Carl

---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

cents = 1200*ln(x)/ln(2), where ln is the natural log function and x is
the decimal or fractional representation of the note. This is the same as
cents=1200*log2(x) if you happen to have a log2 (log base 2) function
handy.

Converting from decimal to fraction is not a simple formula but an algorithm.

Using example 1.342

1. Multiply by a power of ten sufficient to make it an integer and then
divide by the same number, e.g, 1.342 * 1000/1000 = 1342/1000

2. Reduce the fraction, e.g. (1342/2)/(1000/2) = 671/500 (That one
happened to work in 1 step, but more often you'll have to divide by
several primes to reduce it).

> Charles and Carl,
> Ok I finally have a copy of the demo harmonized melody of 12 tone
> modulated up: http://geocities.com/djtrancendance/microtonal/12mt2.mp3
> Enjoy!
>
> You might notice subtle changes of notes and mood each time the main
> melody is played, intended to enhance the mood flexibility limits
> beyond that of Western tunings.
>>>>>>
> Although the timbre overtones vs. root notes don't always match hence
> I'd appreciate it if anyone would help me
> A) Come up with a theory of building chords in the scale (not by solely
> ear, as I have done)
> B) Come up with a theory of the ideal timbre/overtone frequency multiples
> for each note in the scale...to produce ideal "Just-Intonation"-like
> consonance on electronic instruments
> <<<<<<<
>
> Also, for the record, in case by odd chance it gets anywhere, I would
> rather not call it "Mike's scale" or anything else slightly
> ego-centric...
> I would rather just say that if any people have ideas for enhancing the
> scale I would greatly appreciate it if they contacted me to tell me
> what they are doing (in the same way Linus has "creative control
> ownership" of Linux).
>
> Carl,
> Thanks for the proper "scala" restatement of the scale...hopefully it
> will make reading it a bit easier for everyone else. :-)
> Actually, for future reference (since the program I use to do
> microtonal, the OPENMPT tracker, uses decimals not cents for
> micro-tunings), what's the conversion formula from decimals to cents
> and, for complex fractions like 369/367, from decimals to fractions?
>
>
> -Michael
>
>
> Carl Lumma <carl@...> wrote: Hi Michael,
>
> >Charles (and anyone else interested),
> >
> >The ratios for my 12 Modulated Temperament are (fine tuned by ear...so
> >left in decimal rather than fractional format)
> >
> >A5 1
> >B5 1.125
> >C5 1.142
> >D5 1.187
> >E5 1.212
> >F5 1.245
> >G5 1.3333
> >H5 1.5
> >I5 1.615
> >J5 1.6666
> >K5 1.8
> >L5 1.89777
> >A6 2
>
> I'd write it like this:
>
> !
> Michael Sheiman's "12-MT" scale.
> 12
> !
> 9/8
> 229.875
> 296.784
> 332.868
> 379.375
> 4/3
> 3/2
> 829.841
> 5/3
> 9/5
> 1109.166
> 2/1
> !
>
> This uses rationals and cents instead of your decimal
> factors. There's nothing wrong with decimal factors, but
> microtonal musicians are typically more familiar with
> cents and rational numbers. The above is also in Scala
> scale file format (if you paste it into a text file
> with .scl extension).
>
> One thing about this scale is that it isn't very close
> to 12-ET. The first step is a whole tone not a half
> tone, and there's a very small step after that.
>
> > Note, at least to my ear, I5 and C5 are the most sour notes by a
> >good margin...feel free to find better ratios for these: in fact I
> >would greatly appreciate it.
> >
> > Also, I will upload a demo song I have made for this scale soon...
>
> Great!
>
> -Carl
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it
> now.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

--
http://DoctorOakroot.com - Rough-edged songs on quirky homemade guitars.
~ Shroud for the Dead ~ available at http://cdbaby.com/cd/droakroot7

Hi Michael,

> Charles and Carl,
> Ok I finally have a copy of the demo harmonized melody of 12 tone
>modulated up: http://geocities.com/djtrancendance/microtonal/12mt2.mp3
> Enjoy!

Sounds good. Sounds like it could be part of a larger piece!

> Although the timbre overtones vs. root notes don't always match
>hence I'd appreciate it if anyone would help me
>A) Come up with a theory of building chords in the scale (not by
>solely ear, as I have done)
>B) Come up with a theory of the ideal timbre/overtone frequency
>multiples for each note in the scale...to produce ideal
>"Just-Intonation"-like consonance on electronic instruments

Well, b) is pretty well in hand.

http://eceserv0.ece.wisc.edu/~sethares/

Thumtronics (a company Bill is involved with) is working on
software that does this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nd4h8vmEsQM#SAFsCUTZ470

>Carl,
> Thanks for the proper "scala" restatement of the scale...hopefully
>it will make reading it a bit easier for everyone else. :-)
> Actually, for future reference (since the program I use to do
>microtonal, the OPENMPT tracker, uses decimals not cents for
>micro-tunings), what's the conversion formula from decimals to cents
>and, for complex fractions like 369/367, from decimals to fractions?

Looks like Dr. Oakroot took care of cents. In addition to his
method of reducing to fractions, you can use continued fractions
to find simpler fractions near your target ratio. Many programming
languages have this functionality.

-Carl

Hi

But unfortunately I havn't any access to your link as in iran ,
geocities is filtered.

Shaahin mohajeri , Tombak player and microtonalist

My web site <http://240edo.googlepages.com/>

My farsi page in harmonytalk <http://www.harmonytalk.com/mohajeri>

Irandrumz ensemble

*********

www.kayson-ir.com <http://www.kayson-ir.com/>

2288 Iranzamin bldg Iranzamin Ave.

Shahrak Qods, Tehran 14656, Iran
Telephone: (9821) 88072501-9

Fax: (9821) 88072500
Email: shahinm@... <mailto:shahinm@...>

P Please consider the environment before printing this mail note.

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