Two-Part Invention in 7ET

In 5/8 meter, with a pentatonic subject, uploaded here:

http://www.h-pi.com/downloads.html

Yours,
Aaron Hunt
H-Pi Instruments

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, Aaron Andrew Hunt <aahunt@...>
wrote:
>
> In 5/8 meter, with a pentatonic subject, uploaded here:
>
> http://www.h-pi.com/downloads.html

From whence this sudden outburst of creativity?

Hi

Very beatiful and nice

Shaahin Mohajeri

Tombak Player & Researcher , Microtonal Composer

My web siteوب سايت شاهين مهاجري <http://240edo.googlepages.com/>

My farsi page in Harmonytalk صفحه اختصاصي در هارموني تاك <http://www.harmonytalk.com/mohajeri>

Shaahin Mohajeri in Wikipedia شاهين مهاجري دردائره المعارف ويكي پديا <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaahin_mohajeri>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Default mid rendering in my computer sounds ugly, but the piece is fine.
7edo is one of my favorite tunings. I will try to post some old unfinished sketches in 7edo soon.
aum

Aaron Andrew Hunt wrote:
> In 5/8 meter, with a pentatonic subject, uploaded here:
>
> http://www.h-pi.com/downloads.html
>
> Yours,
> Aaron Hunt
> H-Pi Instruments

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--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, aum <aum@...> wrote:
>
> Default mid rendering in my computer sounds ugly, but the piece is
fine.
> 7edo is one of my favorite tunings. I will try to post some old
> unfinished sketches in 7edo soon.
> aum
>
> Aaron Andrew Hunt wrote:
> > In 5/8 meter, with a pentatonic subject, uploaded here:
> >
> > http://www.h-pi.com/downloads.html
> >
> > Yours,
> > Aaron Hunt
> > H-Pi Instruments

Please do so, aum! But they'll have to be *good* to
come up to the benchmark that Aaron has set - this
7-EDO, 5/8 piece simply *rocks*!

Thanks, Aaron, you're
an inpiration!

Regards,
Yahya

> Please do so, aum! But they'll have to be *good* to
> come up to the benchmark that Aaron has set - this
> 7-EDO, 5/8 piece simply *rocks*!

At the risk of sounding stupid... wasn't this 17, not 7??

-Chris Bryan

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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sorry for repeated posts but: [Non-text portions of this message have
been removed]. Twice. Do anybody know what it means and why it occurred?

My original message was:
c.m.bryan wrote:
>> Please do so, aum! But they'll have to be *good* to
>> come up to the benchmark that Aaron has set - this
>> 7-EDO, 5/8 piece simply *rocks*!
>>
>
>
> At the risk of sounding stupid... wasn't this 17, not 7??
>
> -Chris Bryan

My comment belongs to Aaron Hunt's Two-Part Invention in 7ET - Synth
'Atmosphere' (February 4, 2007), which sounds 7edo to me.
aum

And in the meantime I have uploaded some old 7edo sketches:
http://www.noise.cz/uvnitr/MG/7.html
I do not know if they are good enough but I still think that 7edo is
worth exploring. Any comments strongly welcomed.

Milan (aum)

> At the risk of sounding stupid... wasn't this 17, not 7??
>
> -Chris Bryan

Whoops, now I listened to the right one!

I like both very much :)

Hi Aaron,

I agree with Yahya -- your music rocks!, especially
the 7-ET invention.

And congratulations on getting all your hardware
and software out there!

-monz
http://tonalsoft.com
Tonescape microtonal music software

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "yahya_melb" <yahya@...> wrote:
>
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, aum <aum@> wrote:
> >
> > Default mid rendering in my computer sounds ugly, but
> > the piece is fine.
> > 7edo is one of my favorite tunings. I will try to post
> > some old unfinished sketches in 7edo soon.
> > aum
> >
> > Aaron Andrew Hunt wrote:
> > > In 5/8 meter, with a pentatonic subject, uploaded here:
> > >
> > > http://www.h-pi.com/downloads.html
> > >
> > > Yours,
> > > Aaron Hunt
> > > H-Pi Instruments
>
> Please do so, aum! But they'll have to be *good* to
> come up to the benchmark that Aaron has set - this
> 7-EDO, 5/8 piece simply *rocks*!
>
> Thanks, Aaron, you're
> an inpiration!

>And in the meantime I have uploaded some old 7edo sketches:
>http://www.noise.cz/uvnitr/MG/7.html
>I do not know if they are good enough but I still think that 7edo is
>worth exploring. Any comments strongly welcomed.
>
>Milan (aum)

It's you! I was just listening to Spendliky the other day.

-Carl

>And in the meantime I have uploaded some old 7edo sketches:
>http://www.noise.cz/uvnitr/MG/7.html
>I do not know if they are good enough but I still think that 7edo is
>worth exploring. Any comments strongly welcomed.
>
>Milan (aum)

I didn't care for the first sketch. I liked the reggae sketch
following that (starting around 0:40). Didn't much care for
the 3rd sketch (blues). The bells thing was cool. The 5th
sketch (oom-pah) was cool. Though I must say I find 7-ET a
very boring a tuning. The 6th sketch was sort of lifeless.
The 7th sketch, with piano, was neat. As is the mbira sketch.
More reggae.

... A lot of neat ideas in there...

-Carl

Thanks everyone, for listening to my music and for the kind words.

Milan, I enjoyed your sketches in 7edo. I think a very curious aspect of this tuning is the
ambiguity of the thirds, which may be made to sound major or minor depending on
context, and I felt several of your sketches brought this out nicely.

You noted that the invention I wrote sounded 7edo, and it is. I use the term 7ET where
others would use 7edo, and others 7-tet, and still others 7ED2. I used to be adamant
about using ED2 because I didn't like the word 'octave' to be used in microtonal music, but
have since changed my views.

I hope you find time to get back to your sketches; there are many ideas there worth
developing : )

Cheers,
Aaron Hunt

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "aumidi" <aum@...> wrote:
>

> My comment belongs to Aaron Hunt's Two-Part Invention in 7ET - Synth
> 'Atmosphere' (February 4, 2007), which sounds 7edo to me.
> aum
>
> And in the meantime I have uploaded some old 7edo sketches:
> http://www.noise.cz/uvnitr/MG/7.html
> I do not know if they are good enough but I still think that 7edo is
> worth exploring. Any comments strongly welcomed.
>
> Milan (aum)
>

Hi Joe; thank you and likewise congratulations on your pioneering work with Tonalsoft.
Like everyone else reading this (I hope), I would like to see many more people producing
microtonally oriented products. Wouldn't it be great if demand forced all kinds of
competition, new companies emerged and the MIDI standard changed to be completely
microtonally oriented? A pipe dream, I know... but at least we will do our part for the
future ; )

I like this group because it reflects the goal - for people to make music!

Yours,
Aaron Hunt
http://www.h-pi.com

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "monz" <monz@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Aaron,
>
>
> I agree with Yahya -- your music rocks!, especially
> the 7-ET invention.
>
> And congratulations on getting all your hardware
> and software out there!
>
>
> -monz
> http://tonalsoft.com
> Tonescape microtonal music software
>
>
>
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "yahya_melb" <yahya@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, aum <aum@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Default mid rendering in my computer sounds ugly, but
> > > the piece is fine.
> > > 7edo is one of my favorite tunings. I will try to post
> > > some old unfinished sketches in 7edo soon.
> > > aum
> > >
> > > Aaron Andrew Hunt wrote:
> > > > In 5/8 meter, with a pentatonic subject, uploaded here:
> > > >
> > > > http://www.h-pi.com/downloads.html
> > > >
> > > > Yours,
> > > > Aaron Hunt
> > > > H-Pi Instruments
> >
> > Please do so, aum! But they'll have to be *good* to
> > come up to the benchmark that Aaron has set - this
> > 7-EDO, 5/8 piece simply *rocks*!
> >
> > Thanks, Aaron, you're
> > an inpiration!
>

aumidi wrote:

> And in the meantime I have uploaded some old 7edo sketches:
> http://www.noise.cz/uvnitr/MG/7.html
> I do not know if they are good enough but I still think that 7edo is
> worth exploring. Any comments strongly welcomed. > > Milan (aum)

Definitely some ideas worth exploring here. Reminds me a bit of background music from late 90's-era video games. Some timbres work out better than others in this tuning. The brass section around 1:10 - 2:15 works unexpectedly well considering how far 7-et deviates from just fifths. Possibly because of the low register -- the higher-pitched brass around 3:30 seems more dissonant. The piano timbre around 5:00 sounds like a piano that hasn't been tuned in decades.

As you might expect, non-harmonic timbres like the marimba / vibraphone sequence around 8:00 - 9:00 hold up pretty well in this tuning. But the brass band with banjo that follows is also fine. Bright timbres with lots of overtones seem to work better than dull timbres, which focus attention on the mismatched 2nd and 3rd overtones in fifths.

Thanks for reply.

Carl:
I am glad you were listening to Spendliky again.
The first sketch is based on the lengthening of melodic line. I have a text, following partly the same principle. A song might be more interesting.
#3 - I am not a blues man at all, as you could hear from this piece, but neutral 3rd evoked the blues mood to me. Life version with long singing story would be better. The idea was to make an endless sequence of T-S progressions. The cycle is much shorter in 7edo than in 12edo and might be perceived.
Do you mean that 7-et is boring to work with it or listening to it?

Aaron:
Thanks for the word "adamant", I have never heard it before. I prefer to use EDO for equal division, in the sense "equal division of". So 12tet is 12edo2 or 12edo1200c, BP et scale is 13edo3, etc. In the case of octave 2:1 the number after EDO can be omitted, so we are speaking about 7edo now. I do not like the term octave in general microtonal context too. Thinking about something like "modulus"...

Herman:
That's true. Brighter and inharmonic timbres sound less dissonant in most cases. But I like some dissonances in some kinds of music (oom-pah/blues/brass bands, etc.). All the pieces are really only sketches, many parts are improvised and recorded without any corrections, some are hard-quantised, some are step-sequenced. All rendering is done using Roland SC-55 without much care about sound colours and mix. Is it the sound or the music, which reminds you video games? Roland SC series are 80/90s synths, MT-32 was sort of PC games sound standard for some time. But I know very little about video & pc games.

All:
For me 7edo is something between standard diatonic and chromatic scale. Could I call it "tempered diatonic scale"? It has 7 steps with the same meaning as diatonic scale, all steps have equal size as in et-chromatic scale. 2nd 171.4c is between Ptolemy 2nd (11/10) and Didymus 2nd (10/9) - perfect for melodic progression. Neutral 3rd, very close to 11/9, is in between minor and major 3rd and can serve as all three ones. 4th and 5th are 16c from just, more or less dissonant but recognizable and functional. Neutral 6th and 7th.
The scale has overall neutral character (ambiguity between dur and moll). Longer melodic sequences in 2nds are wholetone-like.
Since the scale has prime number of steps it has simple (complete) cycles of every interval (not only of 4ths and 5ths like 12edo), which might be used as additional feature of symmetry. The harmony differs form standard 7of12 diatonic systems. But it will be longer story...

Thanks again for your kind comments.

Milan

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--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt" <aahunt@...>
wrote:

> Wouldn't it be great if demand forced all kinds of
> competition, new companies emerged and the MIDI standard changed to
be completely
> microtonally oriented? A pipe dream, I know... but at least we will
do our part for the
> future ; )

The official tuning standad has already been changed to be completely
microtonally oriented. That happened some time ago. The problem is, the
lazy sods who write the software don't implement it. Shame on them.

First of all, the MIDI Tuning Standard (MTS) is not a standard at all, it suggests a set of
multiple protocols which don't even agree with one another. More importantly, it is about
the furthest thing possible from an industry standard. Manufacturers have ignored it, for
the following reasons:

1) There are too many formats suggested so nobody can decide which one to support
2) They can't figure out how to implement the format once they decide to support it
3) The suggested protocols depend on sysex which is just too scary
4) It's all too confusing so they throw up their hands and say forget it

What I am talking about is not the confusing plethora of stop-gap, add-on, fix-it
suggestions of MTS, though I heartily applaud everyone who has fought for those changes,
and I am not their enemy because we are all on the same team. Alas, that approach has
failed to achieve results.

I'm talking about changing basic MIDI messages, changing the core MIDI spec to cope with
microtuning EASILY. Technology is supposed to make things easier to do. That's what I am
dreaming of, hoping for, and trying to help bring about in any way I can.

Yours,
Aaron Hunt
http://www.h-pi.com

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Ward Smith" <genewardsmith@...>
wrote:
>
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt" <aahunt@>
> wrote:
>
> > Wouldn't it be great if demand forced all kinds of
> > competition, new companies emerged and the MIDI standard changed to
> be completely
> > microtonally oriented? A pipe dream, I know... but at least we will
> do our part for the
> > future ; )
>
> The official tuning standad has already been changed to be completely
> microtonally oriented. That happened some time ago. The problem is, the
> lazy sods who write the software don't implement it. Shame on them.
>

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt" <aahunt@...>
wrote:

> I'm talking about changing basic MIDI messages, changing the core
MIDI spec to cope with
> microtuning EASILY. Technology is supposed to make things easier to
do. That's what I am
> dreaming of, hoping for, and trying to help bring about in any way I
can.

That's not going to work very well using an Apple-only approach.

What I would like to see for starters is implementation of something
other than pitch bend which MIDI players, playing MIDI files with the
usual synth crap, will actually play. This basic advance just doesn't
seem to be happening.

aum wrote:

> Herman:
> That's true. Brighter and inharmonic timbres sound less dissonant in > most cases. But I like some dissonances in some kinds of music > (oom-pah/blues/brass bands, etc.). All the pieces are really only > sketches, many parts are improvised and recorded without any > corrections, some are hard-quantised, some are step-sequenced. All > rendering is done using Roland SC-55 without much care about sound > colours and mix. Is it the sound or the music, which reminds you video > games? Roland SC series are 80/90s synths, MT-32 was sort of PC games > sound standard for some time. But I know very little about video & pc games.

I was wondering if it was a Roland. We used Roland Sound Canvas sound cards (among others) at Origin back in the 90's, and the Edirol VSC which I've used recently for some of my music is a software emulation of those. I don't know what audio technology was used in consoles like the Nintendo 64, but it must have been something similar.

Besides the timbres, some of the styles of the music reminded me of the sort of ambient background music you might find in a game. I'm thinking in particular of parts like the low strings around 4:00 with the electric guitar melody that comes in around 4:30, or the brass and percussion around 8:00. Relatively sparse musical textures to create a mood while leaving space for other game sounds to be heard at the same time.

Dissonance is certainly an aspect of music that I appreciate, and sometimes a more dissonant combination of tuning and timbre fits the music better than a more pleasant one.

All H-Pi Instruments software is cross-platform, Windows and OSX.

Until the basic MIDI spec changes, pitch bend is the most universally compatible method
there is to acheive microtuning.

The problem of pitch bend could be very easily solved by making the pitch bend message
a note message instead of a channel message. This should have been done at the
beginning.

There is a possible MIDI spec upgrade which will change the number of channels from 16
to 128. Then even if pitch bending doesn't get an upgrade we are all much better off.

Aaron Hunt
H-Pi Instruments
http://www.h-pi.com

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Ward Smith" <genewardsmith@...>
wrote:
>
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt" <aahunt@>
> wrote:
>
> > I'm talking about changing basic MIDI messages, changing the core
> MIDI spec to cope with
> > microtuning EASILY. Technology is supposed to make things easier to
> do. That's what I am
> > dreaming of, hoping for, and trying to help bring about in any way I
> can.
>
> That's not going to work very well using an Apple-only approach.
>
> What I would like to see for starters is implementation of something
> other than pitch bend which MIDI players, playing MIDI files with the
> usual synth crap, will actually play. This basic advance just doesn't
> seem to be happening.
>

What surprises me about the generalized keyboard controllers that are
coming out, is that only one of them, the Thummer, seems to have a USB
jack. USB is a standard connector on even the cheapest MIDI keyboards
these days.

The Thummer is also the only upcoming controller that will send Open
Sound Control (OSC) messages via the USB jack. OSC may be
underutilized, but it's still out there, people are using it, and it
ultimately offers a lot more control than MIDI in so many ways.

It'll also have a MIDI OUT jack for the old-school types. :)

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt"
<aahunt@...> wrote:
>
> All H-Pi Instruments software is cross-platform, Windows and OSX.
>
> Until the basic MIDI spec changes, pitch bend is the most
universally compatible method
> there is to acheive microtuning.
>
> The problem of pitch bend could be very easily solved by making the
pitch bend message
> a note message instead of a channel message. This should have been
done at the
> beginning.
>
> There is a possible MIDI spec upgrade which will change the number
of channels from 16
> to 128. Then even if pitch bending doesn't get an upgrade we are all
much better off.
>
> Aaron Hunt
> H-Pi Instruments
> http://www.h-pi.com
>
>
>
>
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Ward Smith"
<genewardsmith@>
> wrote:
> >
> > --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt" <aahunt@>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I'm talking about changing basic MIDI messages, changing the core
> > MIDI spec to cope with
> > > microtuning EASILY. Technology is supposed to make things easier to
> > do. That's what I am
> > > dreaming of, hoping for, and trying to help bring about in any
way I
> > can.
> >
> > That's not going to work very well using an Apple-only approach.
> >
> > What I would like to see for starters is implementation of something
> > other than pitch bend which MIDI players, playing MIDI files with the
> > usual synth crap, will actually play. This basic advance just doesn't
> > seem to be happening.
> >
>

At 08:05 AM 2/9/2007, you wrote:
>What surprises me about the generalized keyboard controllers that are
>coming out, is that only one of them, the Thummer, seems to have a USB
>jack. USB is a standard connector on even the cheapest MIDI keyboards
>these days.

Tell me about it.

>The Thummer is also the only upcoming controller that will send Open
>Sound Control (OSC) messages via the USB jack. OSC may be
>underutilized, but it's still out there, people are using it, and it
>ultimately offers a lot more control than MIDI in so many ways.
>
>It'll also have a MIDI OUT jack for the old-school types. :)

I've been waiting for this thing. When's it coming out?

-Carl

What possible MIDI spec upgrade which will change the number of channels from 16 to 128 do you mean?
Milan Aaron Andrew Hunt wrote:
> There is a possible MIDI spec upgrade which will change the number of channels from 16 > to 128. Then even if pitch bending doesn't get an upgrade we are all much better off.

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--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, Carl Lumma <ekin@...> wrote:
> I've been waiting for this thing. When's it coming out?

I just took a peek at the Thummer forums. Latest post was 1/31/2007,
offering reassurance of the product still being under development (ie.
not cancelled), but not offering time estimates.

The decision to add a MIDI out jack may have slowed down development.
I think the beta tester feedback may also have slowed it down as well
- they're asking for smaller joysticks, they don't like the feel of
the keys, etc. Here's the feedback thread:

http://www.thumtronics.com/community/forums/104/ShowPost.aspx

Hi Paolo,

I can answer for H-Pi Instruments on the lack of USB connectivity.

Although USB jacks are almost standard at this point on new gear, the problem remains
that music gear manufacturers are not implementing USB in a generic cross compatible
way, and this defies the very reason MIDI was originally invented - to standardize
compatibility. There are all kinds of USB controllers that don't communicate with anything
outside of a computer, and don't even communicate with other USB MIDI devices. Driver
class compliancy is becoming more standard, but here we are talking about computers
being requirement for using MIDI gear, which is again not a situation MIDI was intended to
foster. So USB represents neither general compatibility nor backward compatibility nor a
new standard where MIDI is concerned. Since the MMA has still not declared the DIN
obsolete, it's still the MIDI standard. Whereas the MIDI DIN was not competing with some
other serial standard when adopted for MIDI almost 30 years ago, in contrast USB was
already a different standard, and using it for MIDI is tricky, because it's a kind of jerry-rig.

So, until the MMA really decide what to do about its 20 year old hardware spec and its 20
year old protocol, H-Pi Instruments will wait. However, we are considering building some
USB-only (for computer use only, not standard MIDI DIN compatible) hardware devices.
This makes sense because it avoids the big mess of non-compatibility.

Yours,
Aaron Hunt
H-Pi Instruments
http://www.h-pi.com

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "paolovalladolid" <phv40@...> wrote:
>
> What surprises me about the generalized keyboard controllers that are
> coming out, is that only one of them, the Thummer, seems to have a USB
> jack. USB is a standard connector on even the cheapest MIDI keyboards
> these days.
>
> The Thummer is also the only upcoming controller that will send Open
> Sound Control (OSC) messages via the USB jack. OSC may be
> underutilized, but it's still out there, people are using it, and it
> ultimately offers a lot more control than MIDI in so many ways.
>
> It'll also have a MIDI OUT jack for the old-school types. :)
>
>
>
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt"
> <aahunt@> wrote:
> >
> > All H-Pi Instruments software is cross-platform, Windows and OSX.
> >
> > Until the basic MIDI spec changes, pitch bend is the most
> universally compatible method
> > there is to acheive microtuning.
> >
> > The problem of pitch bend could be very easily solved by making the
> pitch bend message
> > a note message instead of a channel message. This should have been
> done at the
> > beginning.
> >
> > There is a possible MIDI spec upgrade which will change the number
> of channels from 16
> > to 128. Then even if pitch bending doesn't get an upgrade we are all
> much better off.
> >
> > Aaron Hunt
> > H-Pi Instruments
> > http://www.h-pi.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Ward Smith"
> <genewardsmith@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt" <aahunt@>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > I'm talking about changing basic MIDI messages, changing the core
> > > MIDI spec to cope with
> > > > microtuning EASILY. Technology is supposed to make things easier to
> > > do. That's what I am
> > > > dreaming of, hoping for, and trying to help bring about in any
> way I
> > > can.
> > >
> > > That's not going to work very well using an Apple-only approach.
> > >
> > > What I would like to see for starters is implementation of something
> > > other than pitch bend which MIDI players, playing MIDI files with the
> > > usual synth crap, will actually play. This basic advance just doesn't
> > > seem to be happening.
> > >
> >
>

Aaron,

I do understand the need to have your instruments be able to control
hardware synths (ie. synths that do not run as software on general
purpose computers).

I think, however, that many microtonalists are going the softsynth
route, so my comments about being able to control synths via USB
connection were said with softsynths in mind. Softsynths are just so
much more flexible.

Paolo

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt"
<aahunt@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Paolo,
>
> I can answer for H-Pi Instruments on the lack of USB connectivity.
>
> Although USB jacks are almost standard at this point on new gear,
the problem remains
> that music gear manufacturers are not implementing USB in a generic
cross compatible
> way, and this defies the very reason MIDI was originally invented -
to standardize
> compatibility. There are all kinds of USB controllers that don't
communicate with anything
> outside of a computer, and don't even communicate with other USB
MIDI devices. Driver
> class compliancy is becoming more standard, but here we are talking
about computers
> being requirement for using MIDI gear, which is again not a
situation MIDI was intended to
> foster. So USB represents neither general compatibility nor backward
compatibility nor a
> new standard where MIDI is concerned. Since the MMA has still not
declared the DIN
> obsolete, it's still the MIDI standard. Whereas the MIDI DIN was not
competing with some
> other serial standard when adopted for MIDI almost 30 years ago, in
contrast USB was
> already a different standard, and using it for MIDI is tricky,
because it's a kind of jerry-rig.
>
> So, until the MMA really decide what to do about its 20 year old
hardware spec and its 20
> year old protocol, H-Pi Instruments will wait. However, we are
considering building some
> USB-only (for computer use only, not standard MIDI DIN compatible)
hardware devices.
> This makes sense because it avoids the big mess of non-compatibility.
>
> Yours,
> Aaron Hunt
> H-Pi Instruments
> http://www.h-pi.com
>
>
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "paolovalladolid" <phv40@> wrote:
> >
> > What surprises me about the generalized keyboard controllers that are
> > coming out, is that only one of them, the Thummer, seems to have a USB
> > jack. USB is a standard connector on even the cheapest MIDI keyboards
> > these days.
> >
> > The Thummer is also the only upcoming controller that will send Open
> > Sound Control (OSC) messages via the USB jack. OSC may be
> > underutilized, but it's still out there, people are using it, and it
> > ultimately offers a lot more control than MIDI in so many ways.
> >
> > It'll also have a MIDI OUT jack for the old-school types. :)
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt"
> > <aahunt@> wrote:
> > >
> > > All H-Pi Instruments software is cross-platform, Windows and OSX.
> > >
> > > Until the basic MIDI spec changes, pitch bend is the most
> > universally compatible method
> > > there is to acheive microtuning.
> > >
> > > The problem of pitch bend could be very easily solved by making the
> > pitch bend message
> > > a note message instead of a channel message. This should have been
> > done at the
> > > beginning.
> > >
> > > There is a possible MIDI spec upgrade which will change the number
> > of channels from 16
> > > to 128. Then even if pitch bending doesn't get an upgrade we are all
> > much better off.
> > >
> > > Aaron Hunt
> > > H-Pi Instruments
> > > http://www.h-pi.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Ward Smith"
> > <genewardsmith@>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Andrew Hunt"
<aahunt@>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I'm talking about changing basic MIDI messages, changing the
core
> > > > MIDI spec to cope with
> > > > > microtuning EASILY. Technology is supposed to make things
easier to
> > > > do. That's what I am
> > > > > dreaming of, hoping for, and trying to help bring about in any
> > way I
> > > > can.
> > > >
> > > > That's not going to work very well using an Apple-only approach.
> > > >
> > > > What I would like to see for starters is implementation of
something
> > > > other than pitch bend which MIDI players, playing MIDI files
with the
> > > > usual synth crap, will actually play. This basic advance just
doesn't
> > > > seem to be happening.
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

>year old protocol, H-Pi Instruments will wait. However, we are
>considering building some USB-only (for computer use only,
>not standard MIDI DIN compatible) hardware devices.
>This makes sense because it avoids the big mess of non-compatibility.

Why not have both USB and MIDI on the same device?

-Carl

I have not found any connection between Nintendo 64 and Roland, but Roland licensed its technology to many companies. Who knows...
Milan

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I'm following this up over on tuning.

--- In MakeMicroMusic@...m, "Aaron Andrew Hunt" <aahunt@...>
wrote:

> What I am talking about is not the confusing plethora of stop-gap,
add-on, fix-it
> suggestions of MTS, though I heartily applaud everyone who has fought
for those changes,
> and I am not their enemy because we are all on the same team. Alas,
that approach has
> failed to achieve results.
>
> I'm talking about changing basic MIDI messages, changing the core
MIDI spec to cope with
> microtuning EASILY.