Tonescape demo questions...

Joe,

Before I install the Tonescape demo software, could you tell me what the
demo's functional restrictions might be (if any) -- such as time-limited
evaluation, save disabled, audio drop-out or what have you?

Thanks,

jls

Hi J,

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "J.Smith" <jsmith9624@...> wrote:
>
>
> Joe,
>
> Before I install the Tonescape demo software, could
> you tell me what the demo's functional restrictions
> might be (if any) -- such as time-limited evaluation,
> save disabled, audio drop-out or what have you?

Easy question to answer: none.

The only restriction we made on this release is that
we had to remove the ability to create mp3's, because
we have to pay a license for that, and we're not going
to do that until we start making money from Tonescape.

So other than no mp3, this free version of Tonescape
is fully functional. You can still export .tonescape
files as MIDI or Csound files, and use whatever tools
you have for those formats. But the unique lattice
and pitch-height information is lost upon export.

Tonescape gives you Pitch-Height notation which looks
like the piano-roll found in other sequencers, but it's
quantized to whatever your tuning specifies, so you get,
for example:

. 19 equal spaces per octave for 19-edo, or

. 31 unequal spaces per octave for a 31-out-of-55-edo, or

. unequal spaces without octave-equivalence for
Archytas's enharmonic,

etc.

And when you play a .tonescape file in Tonescape, you
see the activated notes from all parts highlighted in
a different color on both the Pitch-Height and Lattice
simultaneously.

-monz
http://tonalsoft.com
Tonescape microtonal music software

>> Joe,
>>
>> Before I install the Tonescape demo software, could
>> you tell me what the demo's functional restrictions
>> might be (if any) -- such as time-limited evaluation,
>> save disabled, audio drop-out or what have you?
>
>
>Easy question to answer: none.
>
>The only restriction we made on this release is that
>we had to remove the ability to create mp3's, because
>we have to pay a license for that, and we're not going
>to do that until we start making money from Tonescape.

You can use LAME. It's quasi-legal, anyway.

-Carl

Hi Carl,

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, Carl Lumma <ekin@...> wrote:

> > The only restriction we made on this release is that
> > we had to remove the ability to create mp3's, because
> > we have to pay a license for that, and we're not going
> > to do that until we start making money from Tonescape.
>
> You can use LAME. It's quasi-legal, anyway.

We did use LAME to make mp3s in the test versions, but
Chris said that there's no way around paying the license fee.

Anyway, our approach to creating .wav, .aif, and .mp3 was
to use our own synthesis engine, and it's my job to create
the instruments and so far i've only made three of them
... and they are, in a word, "lame".

So for now, we think it's fine for Tonescape users to
simply export their files as MIDI or Csound and use the
appropriate tools from that point to create mp3s.

All the example mp3s of Tonescape files that i've ever
posted here were made by Gene from my exported MIDIs.

BTW, you haven't yet joined the Yahoo Tonescape Den Haag
group (it's completely open to anyone):

/tonescape_denhaag/

Tonescape comes with several samples of all three types
of Tonescape files (Musical Pieces, Tunings, and Tonespaces),
but i've been posting a few more interesting sample pieces
in the Files section of that group, and will continue
to do so.

-monz
http://tonalsoft.com
Tonescape microtonal music software

>Anyway, our approach to creating .wav, .aif, and .mp3 was
>to use our own synthesis engine, and it's my job to create
>the instruments and so far i've only made three of them
>... and they are, in a word, "lame".

:)

>So for now, we think it's fine for Tonescape users to
>simply export their files as MIDI or Csound and use the
>appropriate tools from that point to create mp3s.

I'd like to try your lame instruments. Seriously.
Just do wav export. There's no fee for that.

>BTW, you haven't yet joined the Yahoo Tonescape Den Haag
>group (it's completely open to anyone):
>
>/tonescape_denhaag/

Sorry... too many groups in my life. Why not discuss it
on Tuning?

-Carl

Hi Carl,

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, Carl Lumma <ekin@...> wrote:

> I'd like to try your lame instruments. Seriously.
> Just do wav export. There's no fee for that.

Yes, i know. But apparently Chris turn off .wav and .aif
export also. Really, the instruments we have so far are
nothing special at all.

I'll see if i can talk him into putting .wav and .aif export
back in ... but until there's some real interest buzz, don't
expect him to do much. I made the big announcement Sunday
morning on both this list and the main tuning list, and so
far (about 30 hours later) a whole two people have responded.
It's disheartening, after all the work we've put into it.

> > BTW, you haven't yet joined the Yahoo Tonescape Den Haag
> > group (it's completely open to anyone):
> >
> > /tonescape_denhaag/
>
> Sorry... too many groups in my life. Why not discuss it
> on Tuning?

Aw, come on, you *know* this is one group you want to
belong to!

Sure, i'm hoping that folks here and on the main tuning list
will use Tonescape and talk about it. But it still makes
sense to me to have a separate group focused on discussion
of the software itself.

For one thing, we're always running out of room to post
files on these groups, and so why not have a Yahoo group
whose file section will hold nothing but Tonescape files?
Then again, we also have a whole section of our own website
devoted to that.

-monz
http://tonalsoft.com
Tonescape microtonal music software

I've tried it out a little bit. It gave an application error on 2 out of 3 pc's I've tried (one is a laptop). I think there was a problem displaying the lattice. I sent the error report though. Features I'd like to see: input from midi keyboard, output to another synth (or midi yoke), and chord note display ('4:5:6:7'). You can always output to ogg for free. :)

Joe

----- Original Message ----
From: monz <monz@...>
To: MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 5:24:45 PM
Subject: [MMM] Re: Tonescape demo questions...

Hi Carl,

--- In MakeMicroMusic@ yahoogroups. com, Carl Lumma <ekin@...> wrote:

> I'd like to try your lame instruments. Seriously.
> Just do wav export. There's no fee for that.

Yes, i know. But apparently Chris turn off .wav and .aif
export also. Really, the instruments we have so far are
nothing special at all.

I'll see if i can talk him into putting .wav and .aif export
back in ... but until there's some real interest buzz, don't
expect him to do much. I made the big announcement Sunday
morning on both this list and the main tuning list, and so
far (about 30 hours later) a whole two people have responded.
It's disheartening, after all the work we've put into it.

> > BTW, you haven't yet joined the Yahoo Tonescape Den Haag
> > group (it's completely open to anyone):
> >
> > http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ tonescape_ denhaag/
>
> Sorry... too many groups in my life. Why not discuss it
> on Tuning?

Aw, come on, you *know* this is one group you want to
belong to!

Sure, i'm hoping that folks here and on the main tuning list
will use Tonescape and talk about it. But it still makes
sense to me to have a separate group focused on discussion
of the software itself.

For one thing, we're always running out of room to post
files on these groups, and so why not have a Yahoo group
whose file section will hold nothing but Tonescape files?
Then again, we also have a whole section of our own website
devoted to that.

-monz
http://tonalsoft. com
Tonescape microtonal music software

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Joe,

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, Joe <tamahome02000@...> wrote:

> I've tried it out a little bit. It gave an application
> error on 2 out of 3 pc's I've tried (one is a laptop).
> I think there was a problem displaying the lattice.
> I sent the error report though.

I've had that problem too. As i've said, i know that the
computer i've been using it on has something wrong with it,
so feedback like this is valuable, because it's hard for me
to tell which problems are from the software and which are
from the computer.

> Features I'd like to see: input from midi keyboard,
> output to another synth (or midi yoke), and chord note
> display ('4:5:6:7').

Don't hold your breath, unless some C# programmers or
investors get interested in contributing to the project.

Our company has had tough going ever since our
major investor backed out when it was time for him
to put up his money.

> You can always output to ogg for free. :)

That's certainly true ... maybe we can put that in.

But as i said, the way things stand now, the demo is
out there for free for people to play around with, and
we'll be lucky to just get the bugs fixed. Don't expect
any new features to be added anytime soon.

-monz
http://tonalsoft.com
Tonescape microtonal music software

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "monz" <monz@...> wrote:

> I made the big announcement Sunday
> morning on both this list and the main tuning list, and so
> far (about 30 hours later) a whole two people have responded.
> It's disheartening, after all the work we've put into it.

You need to get a version which will install and run. People demand
this; trust me.

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Ward Smith"
<genewardsmith@...> wrote:
>
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "monz" <monz@> wrote:
>
> > I made the big announcement Sunday
> > morning on both this list and the main tuning list, and so
> > far (about 30 hours later) a whole two people have responded.
> > It's disheartening, after all the work we've put into it.
>
> You need to get a version which will install and run. People demand
> this; trust me.

in my case I have interest, but you have told me you don't plan on a
Linux release.

I might be getting a Windows laptop down the road to help my wife with
work--If I check it out later, and it has all the features I need that
I haven't created myself already, I'd give it a go.

BTW, I don't blame you for not releasing a Linux version, or planning
to. For a business venture, it's a good call---the Linux culture
doesn't ever buy software, and probably never will. OTOH, if you end
up not making a whole lot of dough on Tonescape down the road, I'm
sure you 'll find a flock of users if you cross-patform open-sourced
it, with maybe a GUI like GTK, WxWidgets, or FLTK. No doubt about it.

It's ashame, and on of the down-sides of this new open internet
culture---we can't make money on music *or* software anymore.

-A.

Greetings,

I've downloaded the file but not installed it because the download was to a Mac and I've got to transfer to a non-networked Dark Side computer.

Actually, I've been plotting to get a Dark Side computer ever since I heard of Tonescape and that it wouldn't be ported to Mac. So about 6 months ago I opted to rearrange my ISP account and get a 'free' Dell computer. It arrived just before Xmas. So far, the children have been using it as a game station (which is okay) but I have plans for it as a microtonal setup using this software. Now, as soon as I'm finished some other writing projects, I'll be able to install it.

So count me in as a serious party to your venture!

All best wishes,

Gordon Rumson

PS Remember your competing for people's attention: there's Paris Hilton, the open letter from the wife of the Italian Prime Minister, and the latest food from McDonalds. It's tough :)))

On 1-Feb-07, at 8:14 AM, Aaron Krister Johnson wrote:

> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Ward Smith"
> <genewardsmith@...> wrote:
>>
>> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "monz" <monz@> wrote:
>>
>>> I made the big announcement Sunday
>>> morning on both this list and the main tuning list, and so
>>> far (about 30 hours later) a whole two people have responded.
>>> It's disheartening, after all the work we've put into it.

I too have decided to get a PC so I can run various
apps that won't work on Mac... Thinking about a
Pocket PC - will this work for tonescape or other
micro software? If so, what brand/model should I get?
Thanks,
K
--- Gordon Rumson <rumsong@...> wrote:

> Greetings,
>
> I've downloaded the file but not installed it
> because the download
> was to a Mac and I've got to transfer to a
> non-networked Dark Side
> computer.
>
> Actually, I've been plotting to get a Dark Side
> computer ever since I
> heard of Tonescape and that it wouldn't be ported to
> Mac. So about 6
> months ago I opted to rearrange my ISP account and
> get a 'free' Dell
> computer. It arrived just before Xmas. So far, the
> children have
> been using it as a game station (which is okay) but
> I have plans for
> it as a microtonal setup using this software. Now,
> as soon as I'm
> finished some other writing projects, I'll be able
> to install it.
>
> So count me in as a serious party to your venture!
>
> All best wishes,
>
> Gordon Rumson
>
> PS Remember your competing for people's attention:
> there's Paris
> Hilton, the open letter from the wife of the Italian
> Prime Minister,
> and the latest food from McDonalds. It's tough :)))
>
>
>
> On 1-Feb-07, at 8:14 AM, Aaron Krister Johnson
> wrote:
>
> > --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Ward
> Smith"
> > <genewardsmith@...> wrote:
> >>
> >> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "monz"
> <monz@> wrote:
> >>
> >>> I made the big announcement Sunday
> >>> morning on both this list and the main tuning
> list, and so
> >>> far (about 30 hours later) a whole two people
> have responded.
> >>> It's disheartening, after all the work we've put
> into it.
>
>

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At 04:22 PM 2/1/2007, you wrote:
>I too have decided to get a PC so I can run various
>apps that won't work on Mac... Thinking about a
>Pocket PC - will this work for tonescape or other
>micro software? If so, what brand/model should I get?
>Thanks,
>K

Uh... no.

-Carl

bad idea. get a dual core intel mac and run bootcamp or parallels so you can
install and run windoze on the mac. with parallels you can have both OS
running at the same time (its so cool i cant stand it)

On 2/1/07, kevin ryan <bentivi_cdo@...> wrote:
>
> I too have decided to get a PC so I can run various
> apps that won't work on Mac... Thinking about a
> Pocket PC - will this work for tonescape or other
> micro software? If so, what brand/model should I get?
> Thanks,
> K
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

At 05:56 PM 2/1/2007, you wrote:
>bad idea. get a dual core intel mac and run bootcamp or parallels so you can
>install and run windoze on the mac. with parallels you can have both OS
>running at the same time (its so cool i cant stand it)

It is pretty cool. Thanks to Vanderpool.

-Carl