film music/death of the CD

i find it disheartening that there seems to be more interest in takemitsu film music than maybe what he did as real compositions.

i know many composers feel this is where they want to get these days. it is is one of the few outlets for a composer so this interest might exist because of this.
although the type of director that takemitsu worked for are long gone, or if they exist , do not have the f money backing they had, nor are they going to get it.
recently ran across a film composer who will remain anon. at a market.
He was telling me how he was at a meeting with other film composers and he said the one thing they ALL agreed on was how much they all hated their jobs , and on reflection, he realized this has always been the case at such meetings. He was thinking of trying to do something else

go ahead and jump in and don't say you weren't warned.
i for one know more than one individual who ended up giving up music altogether
------------------------------------------------------------

right now the record industries have decided to get rid of the CD .
go out and try and buy a cd player and see how many you can find.
instead we are on the verge of the biggest regression in the history of music
as far as sound quality.
where are all the people who a little over a decade ago complained about CD quality over vinyl
somehow they must of all gone to another planet cause we don't hear a word about how bad downloaded music sounds.
or their voices are being censored

i personally have experienced putting downloads of my music up and getting no response from people who when given a CD will rave about it.
most of the music i have enjoyed by those on this list are from CD or CDr i have traded or been sent.
i am always up for more.
i will admit that i have rarely returned to any MP3 posted and i do not think this is because of the actual music but the medium.
the problem with CDs was the price.
here we have tower going broke and even with 30% off the price is still too high. i bought two things reluctantly only because i thought i would never see them

downloads only serves the money makers, it will make and does make peoples ears worse in a society when most are deaf anyways.
perhaps as the soundscape that surrounds us more and more grows in volume, music like any sound becomes less and less desirable.
we are becoming a society where only visuals matter. look at most pop music, it is the sights that have appeal over the sound.
i suggest you all resist the profiteers in running your art into the ground.

I spent some passing time Monday with Fredric Rzewski out at Pomona before and after his lecture there.
He said he was giving away all his music and scores for free which he suggest all composers do.
Still i cannot fathom trying to listen to the very pieces he played the night before live ( he did a concert) in such a format and even be able to hear what is going on in his difficult, rugged compositions, that even on record, push the dynamics to extreme.there were things live i was able to catch i had missed for years on record.
go download it and i imagine it will be quickly forgotten
but this brings does bring out something on a positive note, it might actually help _*live*_ music,
there is where people will have to go if they want to hear music, and when and if they go, they are going to get blown away with what real people with real instruments can do. those that aren't interested, i would assume really aren't interested in music anyway. which like most of the arts today are filled with just such opportunist and carreerist ,who in reality hate real artistic endeavors.
-- Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>
The Wandering Medicine Show
KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los Angeles

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...> wrote:
>
> i find it disheartening that there seems to be more interest in
> takemitsu film music than maybe what he did as real compositions.

his film scores aren't 'real compositions'?

I like the fake stuff too, I guess--I can only speak to "Gaudi", which
is the only film score of his I'm familiar with ;)

CD-death, live music, etc.:

As for live music, I think it's great, but not particularly as
flexible for microtonal precision as electronic pre-recorded stuff,
which, in the right hands, can be magical (speaking for myself). At
least for microtonal music, live acoustic instruments are cost
prohibitive and potentially space and time prohibitive (more
notes=more materials=more money, besides forcing you to choose very
wisely what tuning to focus on). Hence, I use synths and samplers,
preferably the latter, if done well (I find acoustic sources generally
are *way* more interesting---*there* I agree)

I have had just as many (no, more) moving experiences of recordings
than I have had of live music. Not to mention it's possible to really
dig into the music with leisurly repeated hearings. With live, it's
here, then gone. I know that I might be in the minority here, but I
think Glenn Gould was onto something when he declared that music,
through recordings, could become somethiing akin to
sculpture---whittle away at it until it's ready for the public, and
then let the have it publicly, or privately in their headphones.

mp3s, and especially oggs, can sound transparent with high enough
bitrates. But I agree, I wouldn't ever trade in my CD player and
collection for an iPod, however much Apple & co. inundate us with
cutesy ads.

Vinyl can sound awesome, and it's nice to have that big packaging and
that smell, but it's a fragile medium, and these days very expensive,
and the rotational issue makes the inner grooves less hi-fi than the
outer, no?

-A.

maybe you are misunderstanding me. i might not be clear
of course i have had compelling musical experiences with recordings, (not with any MP3 or ogg i must say though). i live and breathe them daily, i have no visual medium at all these days. pipe organ music gets me high live though which no recording quite does.
same with cecil taylor

i have the exact opposite experience in terms of cost.
electronics is way more expensive and from what i can tell and there is never an end in sight,where one does not need something else.
i doubt if all the instruments i have ever made bought and purchased cost more than most average studios.

but i said nothing against electronic music.
but think it sounds better live or on a decent medium.
although i notice how quickly sounds go out of date

i doubt if glenn gould would be happy with MP3 of his performances.
in fact it might have forced him back into concerts.

film music unfortunately requires a certain shallowness otherwise it will distract from the visuals. it can not follow it own dictates but must follow a medium which is constantly shifting from cut t o cut.
theater is pared of this problem and music can be stronger t o good effect

in terms of takemitsu, i find his compositions for traditional japanese instruments surpasses his ones for western instruments. something that i have only recently noticed.but i like japanese music to begin with.

my favorite film score by anyone ( i guess it is the only one i own) is to the 10th victim , that is because the theme is awesome with some of the strangest chords ever
Aaron Krister Johnson wrote:
> --- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...> wrote:
> >> i find it disheartening that there seems to be more interest in >> takemitsu film music than maybe what he did as real compositions.
>> >
> his film scores aren't 'real compositions'?
> > I like the fake stuff too, I guess--I can only speak to "Gaudi", which
> is the only film score of his I'm familiar with ;)
>
> CD-death, live music, etc.:
>
> As for live music, I think it's great, but not particularly as
> flexible for microtonal precision as electronic pre-recorded stuff,
> which, in the right hands, can be magical (speaking for myself). At
> least for microtonal music, live acoustic instruments are cost
> prohibitive and potentially space and time prohibitive (more
> notes=more materials=more money, besides forcing you to choose very
> wisely what tuning to focus on). Hence, I use synths and samplers,
> preferably the latter, if done well (I find acoustic sources generally
> are *way* more interesting---*there* I agree)
>
> I have had just as many (no, more) moving experiences of recordings
> than I have had of live music. Not to mention it's possible to really
> dig into the music with leisurly repeated hearings. With live, it's
> here, then gone. I know that I might be in the minority here, but I
> think Glenn Gould was onto something when he declared that music,
> through recordings, could become somethiing akin to
> sculpture---whittle away at it until it's ready for the public, and
> then let the have it publicly, or privately in their headphones.
>
> mp3s, and especially oggs, can sound transparent with high enough
> bitrates. But I agree, I wouldn't ever trade in my CD player and
> collection for an iPod, however much Apple & co. inundate us with
> cutesy ads.
>
> Vinyl can sound awesome, and it's nice to have that big packaging and
> that smell, but it's a fragile medium, and these days very expensive,
> and the rotational issue makes the inner grooves less hi-fi than the
> outer, no?
>
> -A.
>
>
>
>
>
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -- Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>
The Wandering Medicine Show
KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los Angeles

First: I don't know the rules about this, but this seems like a
metatuning thing.

On film music: One of my favorite Yoshihide Otomo pieces (On the
Beach, if you know his work) is from, I have been told, a trashy teen
film about lesbians. And then there are movies like "Eli Eli Lema
Sabachthani", "Koyaanisqatsi", "Baraka", and "Cremaster" that use
music as a fundamental driving force rather than as a set-piece. I
think there is room for great music in film.

On 11/8/06, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...> wrote:
>
> I spent some passing time Monday with Fredric Rzewski out at Pomona
> before and after his lecture there.
> He said he was giving away all his music and scores for free which he
> suggest all composers do.

I certainly agree with that, for two reasons:
First, (and so I'm not misunderstood: I hate plagiarism as much as
the next guy) I have violated copyright law so often that I feel I
deserve no protection, so I explicitly release everything public
domain.
And more practically, I couldn't afford to distribute it if I wanted
exclusive rights. Survivability may or may not be a better determining
factor than money and connections, but I'm not in a position to
decide.

> Still i cannot fathom trying to listen to the very pieces he played the
> night before live ( he did a concert) in such a format and even be able
> to hear what is going on in his difficult, rugged compositions, that
> even on record, push the dynamics to extreme.there were things live i
> was able to catch i had missed for years on record.
> go download it and i imagine it will be quickly forgotten

> but this brings does bring out something on a positive note, it might
> actually help _*live*_ music,
> there is where people will have to go if they want to hear music, and
> when and if they go, they are going to get blown away with what real
> people with real instruments can do. those that aren't interested, i
> would assume really aren't interested in music anyway. which like most
> of the arts today are filled with just such opportunist and carreerist
> ,who in reality hate real artistic endeavors.

Assuming that there is a sound-technician alive who doesn't turn the
volume up so high that you can't hear any of the instruments: I've had
to stop listening to live amplified music because it all just blurs
into the same high-pitched noise.

I find that for music with wide dynamics, I have to use the volume
knob to compress on the fly. I live on a busy street, so I have to
turn quiet music up, and I'm volume-sensitive, so I have to turn loud
music down. That has been one of my biggest obstacles in learning to
appreciate classical music, and I agree that it works much better when
I can hear it live.

Still, most of my favorite music I've discovered through mp3, and have
certainly not forgotten. My interest in music was springboarded by a
cassette-tape made on a department-store boom box placed next to a
computer playing mp3s, but the fundamental genius shone through enough
for me to seek out mp3s -- and when I could afford them, records --
and I still cherish many of them:

When I first heard FCS North, one of my current favorite bands, it was
at a live show, and I sought out their music only because of the
visual aspect: I could see what the drummer was doing, and I could
tell that I would like it if I could hear it. Once I heard an mp3, I
was blown away, I got the CD more out of duty than anything else.

The first time I heard "Vision Creation Newsun" by the Boredoms, it
wasn't just mp3 quality but it also had skips where the CD had gapless
tracking. I still fell in love with it and bought the CD.

At least 28 of the songs on my three "favorite music" mixes
(with-words, without-words, and popular), I have never heard on
anything but mp3. Many I discovered through out-of-focus radio and
second-generation cassettes, but remembered years later when I got an
mp3 player.

--TRISTAN
Dreaming of Eden is a Comic with no Pictures
http://dreamingofeden.smackjeeves.com

"Low fidelity" may even be a plus, I suspect, when I think about
many of the most moving listening experiences of my life- growing up
with scratchy old LPs, music overheard from windows high in
apartment buildings in cities, or people singing to themselves when
they think they're utterly alone.

Sabi and Yugen, not by virtue of the physical properties of the
recorded medium good or bad, but through the filter of circumstance.

-Cameron Bobro

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, "Rozencrantz the Sane"
<rozencrantz@...> wrote:
>
> First: I don't know the rules about this, but this seems like a
> metatuning thing.
>
> On film music: One of my favorite Yoshihide Otomo pieces (On the
> Beach, if you know his work) is from, I have been told, a trashy
teen
> film about lesbians. And then there are movies like "Eli Eli Lema
> Sabachthani", "Koyaanisqatsi", "Baraka", and "Cremaster" that use
> music as a fundamental driving force rather than as a set-piece. I
> think there is room for great music in film.
>
> On 11/8/06, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...> wrote:
> >
> > I spent some passing time Monday with Fredric Rzewski out at
Pomona
> > before and after his lecture there.
> > He said he was giving away all his music and scores for free
which he
> > suggest all composers do.
>
> I certainly agree with that, for two reasons:
> First, (and so I'm not misunderstood: I hate plagiarism as much as
> the next guy) I have violated copyright law so often that I feel I
> deserve no protection, so I explicitly release everything public
> domain.
> And more practically, I couldn't afford to distribute it if I
wanted
> exclusive rights. Survivability may or may not be a better
determining
> factor than money and connections, but I'm not in a position to
> decide.
>
> > Still i cannot fathom trying to listen to the very pieces he
played the
> > night before live ( he did a concert) in such a format and even
be able
> > to hear what is going on in his difficult, rugged compositions,
that
> > even on record, push the dynamics to extreme.there were things
live i
> > was able to catch i had missed for years on record.
> > go download it and i imagine it will be quickly forgotten
>
> > but this brings does bring out something on a positive note,
it might
> > actually help _*live*_ music,
> > there is where people will have to go if they want to hear
music, and
> > when and if they go, they are going to get blown away with what
real
> > people with real instruments can do. those that aren't
interested, i
> > would assume really aren't interested in music anyway. which
like most
> > of the arts today are filled with just such opportunist and
carreerist
> > ,who in reality hate real artistic endeavors.
>
> Assuming that there is a sound-technician alive who doesn't turn
the
> volume up so high that you can't hear any of the instruments: I've
had
> to stop listening to live amplified music because it all just blurs
> into the same high-pitched noise.
>
> I find that for music with wide dynamics, I have to use the volume
> knob to compress on the fly. I live on a busy street, so I have to
> turn quiet music up, and I'm volume-sensitive, so I have to turn
loud
> music down. That has been one of my biggest obstacles in learning
to
> appreciate classical music, and I agree that it works much better
when
> I can hear it live.
>
> Still, most of my favorite music I've discovered through mp3, and
have
> certainly not forgotten. My interest in music was springboarded by
a
> cassette-tape made on a department-store boom box placed next to a
> computer playing mp3s, but the fundamental genius shone through
enough
> for me to seek out mp3s -- and when I could afford them, records --
> and I still cherish many of them:
>
> When I first heard FCS North, one of my current favorite bands, it
was
> at a live show, and I sought out their music only because of the
> visual aspect: I could see what the drummer was doing, and I could
> tell that I would like it if I could hear it. Once I heard an mp3,
I
> was blown away, I got the CD more out of duty than anything else.
>
> The first time I heard "Vision Creation Newsun" by the Boredoms, it
> wasn't just mp3 quality but it also had skips where the CD had
gapless
> tracking. I still fell in love with it and bought the CD.
>
> At least 28 of the songs on my three "favorite music" mixes
> (with-words, without-words, and popular), I have never heard on
> anything but mp3. Many I discovered through out-of-focus radio and
> second-generation cassettes, but remembered years later when I got
an
> mp3 player.
>
> --TRISTAN
> Dreaming of Eden is a Comic with no Pictures
> http://dreamingofeden.smackjeeves.com
>

i will draw the line with Philip glass mainly because he does not do his own orchestration nor synth settings.
these are hired out .
he is basically a corporate front man.
film music in general though is this way.
ghost writers galore with one guy whistling a tune or two over the phone

glad MP3 work for you cause that is all you are going to get in the near future

i agree i have heard some terrible sound reinforcement live.
Rozencrantz the Sane wrote:
> First: I don't know the rules about this, but this seems like a
> metatuning thing.
>
> On film music: One of my favorite Yoshihide Otomo pieces (On the
> Beach, if you know his work) is from, I have been told, a trashy teen
> film about lesbians. And then there are movies like "Eli Eli Lema
> Sabachthani", "Koyaanisqatsi", "Baraka", and "Cremaster" that use
> music as a fundamental driving force rather than as a set-piece. I
> think there is room for great music in film.
>
> On 11/8/06, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...> wrote:
> >> I spent some passing time Monday with Fredric Rzewski out at Pomona
>> before and after his lecture there.
>> He said he was giving away all his music and scores for free which he
>> suggest all composers do.
>> >
> I certainly agree with that, for two reasons:
> First, (and so I'm not misunderstood: I hate plagiarism as much as
> the next guy) I have violated copyright law so often that I feel I
> deserve no protection, so I explicitly release everything public
> domain.
> And more practically, I couldn't afford to distribute it if I wanted
> exclusive rights. Survivability may or may not be a better determining
> factor than money and connections, but I'm not in a position to
> decide.
>
> >> Still i cannot fathom trying to listen to the very pieces he played the
>> night before live ( he did a concert) in such a format and even be able
>> to hear what is going on in his difficult, rugged compositions, that
>> even on record, push the dynamics to extreme.there were things live i
>> was able to catch i had missed for years on record.
>> go download it and i imagine it will be quickly forgotten
>> >
> >> but this brings does bring out something on a positive note, it might
>> actually help _*live*_ music,
>> there is where people will have to go if they want to hear music, and
>> when and if they go, they are going to get blown away with what real
>> people with real instruments can do. those that aren't interested, i
>> would assume really aren't interested in music anyway. which like most
>> of the arts today are filled with just such opportunist and carreerist
>> ,who in reality hate real artistic endeavors.
>> >
> Assuming that there is a sound-technician alive who doesn't turn the
> volume up so high that you can't hear any of the instruments: I've had
> to stop listening to live amplified music because it all just blurs
> into the same high-pitched noise.
>
> I find that for music with wide dynamics, I have to use the volume
> knob to compress on the fly. I live on a busy street, so I have to
> turn quiet music up, and I'm volume-sensitive, so I have to turn loud
> music down. That has been one of my biggest obstacles in learning to
> appreciate classical music, and I agree that it works much better when
> I can hear it live.
>
> Still, most of my favorite music I've discovered through mp3, and have
> certainly not forgotten. My interest in music was springboarded by a
> cassette-tape made on a department-store boom box placed next to a
> computer playing mp3s, but the fundamental genius shone through enough
> for me to seek out mp3s -- and when I could afford them, records --
> and I still cherish many of them:
>
> When I first heard FCS North, one of my current favorite bands, it was
> at a live show, and I sought out their music only because of the
> visual aspect: I could see what the drummer was doing, and I could
> tell that I would like it if I could hear it. Once I heard an mp3, I
> was blown away, I got the CD more out of duty than anything else.
>
> The first time I heard "Vision Creation Newsun" by the Boredoms, it
> wasn't just mp3 quality but it also had skips where the CD had gapless
> tracking. I still fell in love with it and bought the CD.
>
> At least 28 of the songs on my three "favorite music" mixes
> (with-words, without-words, and popular), I have never heard on
> anything but mp3. Many I discovered through out-of-focus radio and
> second-generation cassettes, but remembered years later when I got an
> mp3 player.
>
> --TRISTAN
> Dreaming of Eden is a Comic with no Pictures
> http://dreamingofeden.smackjeeves.com
>
>
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -- Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>
The Wandering Medicine Show
KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los Angeles

With the proliferation of big internet bandwidth I hope that in the
not so distant future, downloading big, even uncompressed files will
be possible.
This will be good for sound quality, artistic freedom of publication,
and the planet, because it will save on paper and plastic that goes
with the CDs.

On Nov 9, 2006, at 10:55 AM, Kraig Grady wrote:

> i will draw the line with Philip glass mainly because he does not
> do his
> own orchestration nor synth settings.
> these are hired out .
> he is basically a corporate front man.
>
> film music in general though is this way.
> ghost writers galore with one guy whistling a tune or two over the
> phone
>
> glad MP3 work for you cause that is all you are going to get in the
> near future
>
> i agree i have heard some terrible sound reinforcement live.
>
> Rozencrantz the Sane wrote:
> > First: I don't know the rules about this, but this seems like a
> > metatuning thing.
> >
> > On film music: One of my favorite Yoshihide Otomo pieces (On the
> > Beach, if you know his work) is from, I have been told, a trashy
> teen
> > film about lesbians. And then there are movies like "Eli Eli Lema
> > Sabachthani", "Koyaanisqatsi", "Baraka", and "Cremaster" that use
> > music as a fundamental driving force rather than as a set-piece. I
> > think there is room for great music in film.
> >
> > On 11/8/06, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...> wrote:
> >
> >> I spent some passing time Monday with Fredric Rzewski out at Pomona
> >> before and after his lecture there.
> >> He said he was giving away all his music and scores for free
> which he
> >> suggest all composers do.
> >>
> >
> > I certainly agree with that, for two reasons:
> > First, (and so I'm not misunderstood: I hate plagiarism as much as
> > the next guy) I have violated copyright law so often that I feel I
> > deserve no protection, so I explicitly release everything public
> > domain.
> > And more practically, I couldn't afford to distribute it if I wanted
> > exclusive rights. Survivability may or may not be a better
> determining
> > factor than money and connections, but I'm not in a position to
> > decide.
> >
> >
> >> Still i cannot fathom trying to listen to the very pieces he
> played the
> >> night before live ( he did a concert) in such a format and even
> be able
> >> to hear what is going on in his difficult, rugged compositions,
> that
> >> even on record, push the dynamics to extreme.there were things
> live i
> >> was able to catch i had missed for years on record.
> >> go download it and i imagine it will be quickly forgotten
> >>
> >
> >
> >> but this brings does bring out something on a positive note, it
> might
> >> actually help _*live*_ music,
> >> there is where people will have to go if they want to hear
> music, and
> >> when and if they go, they are going to get blown away with what
> real
> >> people with real instruments can do. those that aren't
> interested, i
> >> would assume really aren't interested in music anyway. which
> like most
> >> of the arts today are filled with just such opportunist and
> carreerist
> >> ,who in reality hate real artistic endeavors.
> >>
> >
> > Assuming that there is a sound-technician alive who doesn't turn the
> > volume up so high that you can't hear any of the instruments:
> I've had
> > to stop listening to live amplified music because it all just blurs
> > into the same high-pitched noise.
> >
> > I find that for music with wide dynamics, I have to use the volume
> > knob to compress on the fly. I live on a busy street, so I have to
> > turn quiet music up, and I'm volume-sensitive, so I have to turn
> loud
> > music down. That has been one of my biggest obstacles in learning to
> > appreciate classical music, and I agree that it works much better
> when
> > I can hear it live.
> >
> > Still, most of my favorite music I've discovered through mp3, and
> have
> > certainly not forgotten. My interest in music was springboarded by a
> > cassette-tape made on a department-store boom box placed next to a
> > computer playing mp3s, but the fundamental genius shone through
> enough
> > for me to seek out mp3s -- and when I could afford them, records --
> > and I still cherish many of them:
> >
> > When I first heard FCS North, one of my current favorite bands,
> it was
> > at a live show, and I sought out their music only because of the
> > visual aspect: I could see what the drummer was doing, and I could
> > tell that I would like it if I could hear it. Once I heard an mp3, I
> > was blown away, I got the CD more out of duty than anything else.
> >
> > The first time I heard "Vision Creation Newsun" by the Boredoms, it
> > wasn't just mp3 quality but it also had skips where the CD had
> gapless
> > tracking. I still fell in love with it and bought the CD.
> >
> > At least 28 of the songs on my three "favorite music" mixes
> > (with-words, without-words, and popular), I have never heard on
> > anything but mp3. Many I discovered through out-of-focus radio and
> > second-generation cassettes, but remembered years later when I
> got an
> > mp3 player.
> >
> > --TRISTAN
> > Dreaming of Eden is a Comic with no Pictures
> > http://dreamingofeden.smackjeeves.com
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> Kraig Grady
> North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>
> The Wandering Medicine Show
> KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los Angeles
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

i hope so
and the big boys can resell all the music they already sold as MP3s!

Alex Pi wrote:
> With the proliferation of big internet bandwidth I hope that in the > not so distant future, downloading big, even uncompressed files will > be possible.
> This will be good for sound quality, artistic freedom of publication, > and the planet, because it will save on paper and plastic that goes > with the CDs.
>
> On Nov 9, 2006, at 10:55 AM, Kraig Grady wrote:
>
> >> i will draw the line with Philip glass mainly because he does not >> do his
>> own orchestration nor synth settings.
>> these are hired out .
>> he is basically a corporate front man.
>>
>> film music in general though is this way.
>> ghost writers galore with one guy whistling a tune or two over the >> phone
>>
>> glad MP3 work for you cause that is all you are going to get in the
>> near future
>>
>> i agree i have heard some terrible sound reinforcement live.
>>
>> Rozencrantz the Sane wrote:
>> >>> First: I don't know the rules about this, but this seems like a
>>> metatuning thing.
>>>
>>> On film music: One of my favorite Yoshihide Otomo pieces (On the
>>> Beach, if you know his work) is from, I have been told, a trashy >>> >> teen
>> >>> film about lesbians. And then there are movies like "Eli Eli Lema
>>> Sabachthani", "Koyaanisqatsi", "Baraka", and "Cremaster" that use
>>> music as a fundamental driving force rather than as a set-piece. I
>>> think there is room for great music in film.
>>>
>>> On 11/8/06, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...> wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>> I spent some passing time Monday with Fredric Rzewski out at Pomona
>>>> before and after his lecture there.
>>>> He said he was giving away all his music and scores for free >>>> >> which he
>> >>>> suggest all composers do.
>>>>
>>>> >>> I certainly agree with that, for two reasons:
>>> First, (and so I'm not misunderstood: I hate plagiarism as much as
>>> the next guy) I have violated copyright law so often that I feel I
>>> deserve no protection, so I explicitly release everything public
>>> domain.
>>> And more practically, I couldn't afford to distribute it if I wanted
>>> exclusive rights. Survivability may or may not be a better >>> >> determining
>> >>> factor than money and connections, but I'm not in a position to
>>> decide.
>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> Still i cannot fathom trying to listen to the very pieces he >>>> >> played the
>> >>>> night before live ( he did a concert) in such a format and even >>>> >> be able
>> >>>> to hear what is going on in his difficult, rugged compositions, >>>> >> that
>> >>>> even on record, push the dynamics to extreme.there were things >>>> >> live i
>> >>>> was able to catch i had missed for years on record.
>>>> go download it and i imagine it will be quickly forgotten
>>>>
>>>> >>> >>>> but this brings does bring out something on a positive note, it >>>> >> might
>> >>>> actually help _*live*_ music,
>>>> there is where people will have to go if they want to hear >>>> >> music, and
>> >>>> when and if they go, they are going to get blown away with what >>>> >> real
>> >>>> people with real instruments can do. those that aren't >>>> >> interested, i
>> >>>> would assume really aren't interested in music anyway. which >>>> >> like most
>> >>>> of the arts today are filled with just such opportunist and >>>> >> carreerist
>> >>>> ,who in reality hate real artistic endeavors.
>>>>
>>>> >>> Assuming that there is a sound-technician alive who doesn't turn the
>>> volume up so high that you can't hear any of the instruments: >>> >> I've had
>> >>> to stop listening to live amplified music because it all just blurs
>>> into the same high-pitched noise.
>>>
>>> I find that for music with wide dynamics, I have to use the volume
>>> knob to compress on the fly. I live on a busy street, so I have to
>>> turn quiet music up, and I'm volume-sensitive, so I have to turn >>> >> loud
>> >>> music down. That has been one of my biggest obstacles in learning to
>>> appreciate classical music, and I agree that it works much better >>> >> when
>> >>> I can hear it live.
>>>
>>> Still, most of my favorite music I've discovered through mp3, and >>> >> have
>> >>> certainly not forgotten. My interest in music was springboarded by a
>>> cassette-tape made on a department-store boom box placed next to a
>>> computer playing mp3s, but the fundamental genius shone through >>> >> enough
>> >>> for me to seek out mp3s -- and when I could afford them, records --
>>> and I still cherish many of them:
>>>
>>> When I first heard FCS North, one of my current favorite bands, >>> >> it was
>> >>> at a live show, and I sought out their music only because of the
>>> visual aspect: I could see what the drummer was doing, and I could
>>> tell that I would like it if I could hear it. Once I heard an mp3, I
>>> was blown away, I got the CD more out of duty than anything else.
>>>
>>> The first time I heard "Vision Creation Newsun" by the Boredoms, it
>>> wasn't just mp3 quality but it also had skips where the CD had >>> >> gapless
>> >>> tracking. I still fell in love with it and bought the CD.
>>>
>>> At least 28 of the songs on my three "favorite music" mixes
>>> (with-words, without-words, and popular), I have never heard on
>>> anything but mp3. Many I discovered through out-of-focus radio and
>>> second-generation cassettes, but remembered years later when I >>> >> got an
>> >>> mp3 player.
>>>
>>> --TRISTAN
>>> Dreaming of Eden is a Comic with no Pictures
>>> http://dreamingofeden.smackjeeves.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> >> -- >> Kraig Grady
>> North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>
>> The Wandering Medicine Show
>> KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los Angeles
>>
>>
>> >
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -- Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>
The Wandering Medicine Show
KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los Angeles

Not quite: Once you have a license to listen to a piece of music, you
can make backup copies, and restore those backups through
file-sharing. If the fidelity creeps up when you restore it, oh well.

Never mind how utterly absurd the very idea of "license to listen" is.

On 11/9/06, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...> wrote:
> i hope so
> and the big boys can resell all the music they already sold as MP3s!

--TRISTAN
Dreaming of Eden is a Comic with no Pictures
http://dreamingofeden.smackjeeves.com

do you think they are going to do this?
let everyone trade in their mp3 versions for wav files.
why is it less absurd to charge for a movie which is the lisense to see ( and then only once try going back in and see what they say?)
the implication that unless it is 'matter' it isn't real.
i would say it might be more real and more substanial than many goods

Rozencrantz the Sane wrote:
> Not quite: Once you have a license to listen to a piece of music, you
> can make backup copies, and restore those backups through
> file-sharing. If the fidelity creeps up when you restore it, oh well.
>
> Never mind how utterly absurd the very idea of "license to listen" is.
>
> On 11/9/06, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...> wrote:
> >> i hope so
>> and the big boys can resell all the music they already sold as MP3s!
>> >
> --TRISTAN
> Dreaming of Eden is a Comic with no Pictures
> http://dreamingofeden.smackjeeves.com
>
>
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -- Kraig Grady
North American Embassy of Anaphoria Island <http://anaphoria.com/>
The Wandering Medicine Show
KXLU <http://www.kxlu.com/main.html> 88.9 FM Wed 8-9 pm Los Angeles

At 02:52 AM 11/9/2006, you wrote:
>With the proliferation of big internet bandwidth I hope that in the
>not so distant future, downloading big, even uncompressed files will
>be possible.

Several artists offer FLAC, including Phish and Charlie Hunter.

-Carl

At 07:54 AM 11/9/2006, you wrote:
>Not quite: Once you have a license to listen to a piece of music, you
>can make backup copies, and restore those backups through
>file-sharing.

Maybe. It's still a matter of case law at this point.

>If the fidelity creeps up when you restore it, oh well.

Not true. You buy the copy, and you have some right to backup and
restore that. You do not buy the music, and you have no right to
the music in a different format.

(Speaking about the U.S., anyway.)

-Carl

>"Koyaanisqatsi", "Baraka"

While the former is among Glass' best, I think the music
for Baraka sucked.

>"Cremaster"

JI Networker and film producer Henry Rosenthal recommended
this to me, but Netflix doesn't have any of them... oh, they
don't seem to be available on DVD. :(

-Carl

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, Kraig Grady <kraiggrady@...> wrote:
>
> i hope so
> and the big boys can resell all the music they already sold as MP3s!

I await the day that P2P filesharing is seen as a threat to microtonal
music.

On 11/9/06, Carl Lumma <ekin@...> wrote:
> >"Koyaanisqatsi", "Baraka"
>
> While the former is among Glass' best, I think the music
> for Baraka sucked.

I liked the music, but in both cases I would never listen to the music
independant of the film.

> >"Cremaster"
>
> JI Networker and film producer Henry Rosenthal recommended
> this to me, but Netflix doesn't have any of them... oh, they
> don't seem to be available on DVD. :(

I found it on bittorrent, in my head I justify it as "would-buy if
could-buy", and if it ever comes back to Seattle I will go see it. I
fondly remember a scene during which I exclaimed "That is no
semitone!"

--TRISTAN
Dreaming of Eden is a Comic with no Pictures
http://dreamingofeden.smackjeeves.com

What luck! A magazine here rereleases classic movies, usually more
offbeat ones, and this morning the very films I was going to mention
on this thread are included! For about 8 dollars, hohoho!

Aguirre the Wrath of God and Cobra Verde, two great Herzog/Kinski
movies with very nice Popol Vuh soundtracks, including African folk
music in Cobra Verde, just the extras in the movie filmed live
singing and left in the final cut. Strange how Herzog later said
he'd cut out such scenes, which I consider highlights, but maybe
that's a conflict between the eyes and ears (and director's egos?)
that tends to weaken film music.

Other fine soundtracks- Zardoz, Planet of the Apes (the first
couple), The Ultimate Warrior, A Clockwork Orange of course... hmmm,
basically lots of "bad" (a.k.a. great) movies have the deepest
soundtracks.

And what about the Artemiev soundtracks? (Tarkovsky). You can get
them on Bittorrent (legally, they're put out by elektroshock as
demos). Both Artemiev father and son have music outside 12-tET, too.

-Cameron Bobro

--- In MakeMicroMusic@yahoogroups.com, Carl Lumma <ekin@...> wrote:
>
> At 02:52 AM 11/9/2006, you wrote:
> >With the proliferation of big internet bandwidth I hope that in the
> >not so distant future, downloading big, even uncompressed files will
> >be possible.
>
> Several artists offer FLAC, including Phish and Charlie Hunter.
>
> -Carl
>
At 02:52 AM 11/9/2006, you wrote:
> >With the proliferation of big internet bandwidth I hope that in the
> >not so distant future, downloading big, even uncompressed files will
> >be possible.
>
> Several artists offer FLAC, including Phish and Charlie Hunter.
>
Uncompressed file up loads would be nice but not use for horrible
music like "phish." I hope the sole reaon that bandwidth providers are
doing this isn't for HIPPY JAM BAND MUSIC!!

FIND NEW MUSIC CARL, that doesn't suck. So that you might be able to
talk abotu and own for once some good music.