RE: [SpecMus] octave generalization

On Fri, 06 Jan 2006, Carl Lumma wrote:
>
> Another music/monkey study.
>
> -Carl
>
> >From: "Martin Braun"
[snip]
> >
> >Thanks Kraig! What I found out particular interest were Anthony Wright's
> >results on the octave in monkeys:
> >
> >Music perception and octave generalization in rhesus monkeys
> >
> >Wright AA, Rivera JJ, Hulse SH, Shyan M, Neiworth JJ
> >
> >J Exp Psychol Gen 2000 Sep 129:291-307
> >
> >Abstract
> >Two rhesus monkeys were tested for octave generalization in 8 experiments
by
> >transposing 6- and 7-note musical passages by an octave and requiring
same
> >or different judgments. The monkeys showed no octave generalization to
> >random-synthetic melodies, atonal melodies, or individual notes. They did
> >show complete octave generalization to childhood songs (e.g., "Happy
> >Birthday") and tonal melodies (from a tonality algorithm). Octave
> >generalization was equally strong for 2-octave transpositions but not for
> >0.5- or 1.5-octave transpositions of childhood songs. These results
combine
> >to show that tonal melodies form musical gestalts for monkeys, as they do
> >for humans, and retain their identity when transposed with whole octaves
so
> >that chroma (key) is preserved. This conclusion implicates similar
> >transduction, storage, processing, and relational memory of musical
passages
> >in monkeys and humans and has implications for nature-nurture origins of
> >music perception.
> >
> >Martin
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Kraig Grady"
[snip]
> >
> >> http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/magazine/daily/6297415.htm

That article's unfortunately no longer available.

But the abstract confirms my immediate first
reaction: All monkeys are NOT equal!

Otherwise why would we be comparing them
to the great ape Homo sapiens?

If rhesus monkeys can identify:

a) tunes as gestalts, and

b) octave transpositions;

then there's every likelihood that other great
apes (besides ourselves) can do so, and possibly
more. Given the evidence for language abilities
in the chimp and orang utan, it would be instructive
to find out more about whether they can do more
or less than the rhesus can.

Also, how far back in the primate evolutionary
tree did the following abilities first occur?:

1. octave generalisation;

2. recognition of fourths and fifths.

Regards,
Yahya

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>> Another music/monkey study.
>>
>> >From: "Martin Braun"
>> >Music perception and octave generalization in rhesus monkeys
>> >
>> >Wright AA, Rivera JJ, Hulse SH, Shyan M, Neiworth JJ
>> >J Exp Psychol Gen 2000 Sep 129:291-307
>> >
>> >Abstract
>> >Two rhesus monkeys were tested for octave generalization in 8
>> >experiments by transposing 6- and 7-note musical passages by an
>> >octave and requiring same or different judgments. The monkeys
>> >showed no octave generalization to random-synthetic melodies,
>> >atonal melodies, or individual notes. They did show complete
>> >octave generalization to childhood songs (e.g., "Happy Birthday")
>> >and tonal melodies (from a tonality algorithm). Octave
>> >generalization was equally strong for 2-octave transpositions but
>> >not for 0.5- or 1.5-octave transpositions of childhood songs.
>> >These results combine to show that tonal melodies form musical
>> >gestalts for monkeys, as they do for humans, and retain their
>> >identity when transposed with whole octaves so that chroma (key)
>> >is preserved. This conclusion implicates similar transduction,
>> >storage, processing, and relational memory of musical passages
>> >in monkeys and humans and has implications for nature-nurture
>> >origins of music perception.
>> >
>> >Martin
>> >
>> >From: "Kraig Grady"
>> >> http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/magazine/daily/6297415.htm
>
>That article's unfortunately no longer available.

Typical. Broken links are approaching catastrophe level, as in,
for the human race.

http://lumma.org/microwave/#2005.07.23.2

Another of my pet peeves is that articles are often not dated,
even on reputable news sites!

>But the abstract confirms my immediate first
>reaction: All monkeys are NOT equal!
>
>Otherwise why would we be comparing them
>to the great ape Homo sapiens?
>
>If rhesus monkeys can identify:
>
>a) tunes as gestalts, and
>b) octave transpositions;
>
>then there's every likelihood that other great
>apes (besides ourselves) can do so, and possibly
>more. Given the evidence for language abilities
>in the chimp and orang utan, it would be instructive
>to find out more about whether they can do more
>or less than the rhesus can.
>
>Also, how far back in the primate evolutionary
>tree did the following abilities first occur?:
>
>1. octave generalisation;
>2. recognition of fourths and fifths.
>
>Regards,
>Yahya

Who knows... single studies have a way of measuring something
other than their authors think they're measuring.

I seem to feel I've seen studies with cats and such showing
a preference for consonances, but I can't find any references
at the moment.

-Carl